all claim owners beware
http://bb.bbboy.net/alaskagoldforum-viewthread?forum=2&thread=1588
Powered By BbBoard - http://bb.bbboy.net

charlene91
16:09:48 Fri
Oct 5 2012
all claim owners beware
TO ALL ALASKA CLAIM OWNERS I APOLOGIZE TO YOU AS YOU ALL KNOW I USED TO WORK RAYS CLAIM ON FLUME CREEK WELL HE BROUGHT UP HIS KIN AND HAD A BAD SUMMER ..LAST FALL I INTRODUCE RAY TO SOME GUYS FROM MONTANA THAT I THOUGHT WERE GOOD GUYS WELL THEY ARE NOT THEY USED THE SYSTEM AGAINST ME TO GET ME OFF THE CLAIM AND THEY LIKE I SAID THEY USED MSHA TO JUSTIFY WHAT THEY DO MOSTLY WRONG FOR PEOPLE AND ALASKA ..I ONCE THOUGHT GOOD OF THEM BUT NOW I WOULD NOT LET THEM PICK UP MY DOGS POOP THEY DID A LOT MORE SO IF THEY WANT TO LEASE YOUR CLAIM TELL THEM NO THEY ALSO WILL TRY AND KEEP THE CLAIM OWNER OFF ESPECIALLY DURING CLEAN UPS THESE PEOPLE HAVE NO HONOR

geowizard
02:33:58 Sat
Oct 6 2012
Re: all claim owners beware
Charlene,

Sorry about your experience!

Can you provide more details? These guys may be looking for more claims to lease. Who's next?

- Geowizard

geowizard
16:26:34 Sat
Oct 6 2012
Re: all claim owners beware
Charlene,

Please don't abandon us on this issue!

The mining community depends on reports from other miners and mining claimants that have experiences like this.

Sometimes it isn't really a "scam" but an issue with the "fine print". Leases can contain "clauses" that come to the fore-front and become legal issues.

It is important to bring out those issures on a forum such as this, so everyone can learn and be protected.

- Geowizard

charlene91
22:52:43 Sat
Oct 6 2012
Re: all claim owners beware
there are three parters two of them are msha trainers ..they have deep pockets even a dragline .they also fab trommels .they plan to use flume creek as a place to get their start here in alaska .they have one more year on their lease with ray ..they also said they filed charges against me saying i threaded them but i did not .i told them that i have a LONG menory and i am a patience woman ..

geowizard
15:23:05 Tue
Oct 9 2012
Re: all claim owners beware
Charlene,

No mining claim owner wants to be robbed.

I went through a similar situation over the last three years. The clock has now ran out. The lessee will be gone this coming spring. If he is NOT gone, I will send DNR a "letter of trespass" and the Troopers will evict him.

A lessee can only operate with your permission. As soon as my Lessee misbehaved, I notified Linda Books at DNR by email that I was retracting my permission for the Lessee to operate. Since your permission is required for the Lessee to operate under an APMA, his APMA becomes void when permission is retracted. Yes, he may have a lease. That is legal and binding on both parties. The lease probably doesn't have a clause that guarantees you will provide "permission to operate". If you feel compelled to do so, you should contact Linda and explain that you are "Retracting your permission to operate" on your claim(s) and state your reason for retraction.

YOU are in control and all you have to do is push the button!

I don't allow anyone to push me around on my claims!

- Geowizard

LipCa
02:21:09 Wed
Oct 10 2012
Re: all claim owners beware
I don't think Charlene was on her own claim.....she was on "Ray's" claim.

geowizard
15:54:47 Wed
Oct 10 2012
Re: all claim owners beware

The information applies to any mining claimant that has a lessee.

If you are a mining claimant with an operating lease and a lessee, you may elect at your discretion to retract your permission to operate. This avoids legal tangles with the "lease". The lease gives the lessee the right to a lease. The lessor (claim owner) may at his or her discretion elect to retract permission for cause. One of the best "causes" is the cause where the lessee is not disclosing the gold production from the mine. Gold production must at all times be able to be monitored or audited or verified by the claim owner.

There is a long list of other issues. If you are "threatened or intimidated" by the lessee, that is cause for retraction of permission.

- Geowizard

charlene91
13:59:43 Thu
Oct 11 2012
Re: all claim owners beware
hi YOU ALL LIPCA YOU ARE RIGHT IT IS NOT MY CLAIM AND I DONOT SEE RAY ENDING THE LEASE AFTER ALL HE IS GETTING 10 PER CENT FROM THEM AND IF YOU KNOW RAY ALL HE CARES ABOUT IS MONEY ..AFTER ALL WHEN THEY DISTORYED MY CABIN AND EVERYTHING OF MINE IN IT RAY DID NOTHING ..HE NEVER CONTRACTED ME AT ALL THE REASON I AM PUTTING ALL OF THIS ALL THERE IS TO DO MY BEST TO SEE THAT NOBODY ELSE GETS BURN FROM THEM THEY DO NOT BELONG HERE.. THEY USE PEOPLE AND THEY USE PEOPLES FEAR OF MSHA FOOD FOR THOUGH MINING SAFTEY AND HEALTH HOW CAN THEY PREACH SAFELY WHEN WHAT MSHA DOES WILL CAUSE A SHOOT OUT BETWEEN SOME MINERS AND THE LAW AND YES I WOULD STAND WITH A SERIOUS ALASKA MINER ANY DAY

LipCa
14:48:40 Thu
Oct 11 2012
Re: all claim owners beware
So, MSHA did this?

geowizard
16:26:08 Thu
Oct 11 2012
Re: all claim owners beware

I remain with Charlene on this one. It looks to me like a conflict of interest between recreational mining and commercial mining. Mining partners sometimes disagree on the objective. Partnerships can have a conflict when one or the other decides that a different course or direction in the mining should take place. That has always been a problem with "mining partners".

Dig here? No, Dig there!

I want to lease the mine, and No, we're not leasing the mine!

Our president has through the Department of Labor, given MSHA a greater enforcement role. Through the process of "inspection" and the mining company's failure to "comply", a revenue source is realized for a cash strapped government. Si?

MSHA has come down hard on recreational mining activities on "commercial" mining properties. Are recreational miners subject to regulation under MSHA?

YES, if...

IF recreational mining can be construed as being related to or a part of the commercial mining activity in any way,

then... the "activity" COULD be construed by an MSHA inspector as being subject to MSHA regulation.

The "GOOD OLD DAYS" are GONE!

THIS is the problem with mining and many other businesses today, in the USA.

And Charlene, unfortunately, is right.

- Geowizard




charlene91
23:38:45 Thu
Oct 11 2012
Re: all claim owners beware
lipca m s h a didnot do this but the mt boys are so afaint of msha and they know and use their knowledge of msha and 2 of the partners are msha trainers so they use the system to fatten their wallets

geowizard
02:44:04 Fri
Oct 12 2012
Re: all claim owners beware

An MSHA trainer doesn't have any more authority than anyone else. They have authority to provide training. If they abuse their authority as a trainer to intimidate or destroy personal property, then the MSHA office should be notified of the abuse.

Destruction of personal property is a crime. In Alaska, you can take the people responsible for damages to small claims court. A judge will hear your case and could award repayment for the damages.

- Geowizard

Jim_Alaska
03:25:04 Fri
Oct 12 2012
Re: all claim owners beware
It is my limited understanding that MSHA usually only applies to hardrock, or placer mines that disturb a given amount of acreage, or move a specified amount of tonnage.

So, small scale mines and miners don't fall under MSHA.

geowizard
14:54:51 Fri
Oct 12 2012
Re: all claim owners beware
Jim,

That's right. This apparently is a "commercial" mining operation. MSHA has defined a commercial mining operation as any mining operation that sells gold or any other metal/mineral or sand and gravel commodity onto the open market. I can provide a reference to that if you need more information.

Again, it's my opinion that MSHA wants get more control of ALL mining activities. The regulatory compliance side of mining has become the reason many mining companies are not able to operate and/or unable to obtain financial backing.

- Geowizard

Nanooktoo
17:41:56 Fri
Oct 12 2012
Re: all claim owners beware
There are two sides to each story. Charlene has not given the reason he had a falling out the the MT boys. I as claim owner am satisfied with the MT people.

Ray

geowizard
19:50:06 Fri
Oct 12 2012
Re: all claim owners beware
Ray,

The issue is destruction of personal property.

You may "own a mining claim". The surface is owned by the State of Alaska. If a mining claimant has an issue with a cabin or other fixtures, that is a matter between the State of Alaska and the owner of that cabin.

Example: I have mining claims that have a privately owned cabin within the boundaries of the claims. I don't own the cabin because I own the claims. Therefore, if I take any action to destroy the cabin for any reason, the owner may collect damages for the destruction of their cabin. Destruction of private property is a crime. Charlene has every right to obtain a judgement for destruction of private property including the contents of the cabin.

MSHA trainers do not have authority to condem a cabin as unsafe or unfit. Many cabins in Alaska may not meet code or professional building standards. I may not agree with the house-keeping standards of another person, how-ever, that person has a right to establish their own requirement of what constitutes "good house-keeping".

- Geowizard

geowizard
20:10:23 Fri
Oct 12 2012
Re: all claim owners beware

"There are two sides to each story. Charlene has not given the reason he had a falling out the the MT boys. I as claim owner am satisfied with the MT people.

Ray "



Ray,

I didn't actually serve in Vietnam. However, I am classified as a Vietnam-Era Veteran. Charlene fought along side of other Americans in a conflict which we did not choose. Many of those Americans died in the process of protecting your freedom.

Many Vietnam Vets returned with a mental disorder worse than having died, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD).

I am not a practicing Psychologist. You don't have to have a degree in Psychology to know and understand that many of our brothers and sisters may have a recognizable psychological disorder. One disorder is called Gender Identity Disorder. You need to learn about these things and understand that in the world around us, there are human beings that have disorders that they are not able to control and they must live with every day.

- Geowizard

charlene91
15:27:16 Sat
Oct 13 2012
Re: all claim owners beware
HI YOU ALL ..THE FALLING OUT WITH THE MT BOYS ..WHEN THEY HIRED ME I TOLD THEM BEING A DISABLED COMBAT VET AND GETTING VA MONEY .I HAD TO GET CASH OR GOLD AND THEY UNDERSTANDED THAT AND THE PARTNER THAT I TALKED WITH SAID OK ..AND AFTER WORKING TWO MONTHS ANOTHER PARTNER TOLD ME I HAD TO GO ON THE BOOKS IF I WANTED TO WORK FOR THEM ANY MORE THERE IS MORE ..THE REASON FOR ME WRITTING ALL OF THIS IS TO WARN OTHER ALASKA MINERS THESE PEOPLE DO NOT HAVE ANY HONOR OR RESPECT OTHER PEOPLES STUFF WHILE GETTING THINGS READY TO MINE THERE THEY HAD ME DISTROY AND BURIED STUFF THAT BELONGED TO THE CLAIM OWNER..AND THEY ALSO DID THE SAME .. WHO I HELPED FOR FIVE YEARS ..I AM TELLING THIS EVEN KNOWING THAT THEY WILL FILE CHARGES ON ME FOR BULL ...TO STOP ME FROM TELLING OTHER ALASKAS ABOUT ME LIKE I SAID THERE ARE THREE PARTNERS AND I REMEMBER THE CLAIM OWNER SAID TO ME THAT THERE THIS TOO MANY BOSSES IN THE PARTNERSHIP..SO IF I END UP IN JAIL OR IF MY VA BENFITS END YOU WILL ALL KNOW WHO ..LIKE I SAID CLAIM OWNER BEWARE



all claim owners beware
http://bb.bbboy.net/alaskagoldforum-viewthread?forum=2&thread=1588
Powered By BbBoard - http://bb.bbboy.net