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Walt_Anchorage
04:14:08 Sun
Jan 27 2013

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"Discovery" and claim staking

To stake a claim it is necessary to make a discovery of minerals that would be profitable to mine. Here's a question I have heard several different opinions on. If a piece of ground was previously mined is it necessary to make a new "discovery" to claim that ground? I'm mainly talking about Alaska state claims but I think federal claims would be similar.

I think you would have to make a new discovery to claim the ground but others argue that the original discovery met the requirement. What do you think?



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JOE_S_INDY
04:31:11 Sun
Jan 27 2013

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Re: "Discovery" and claim staking

Hey there Walt, I hope your doing well!

My understanding is that "YOU" must "make the discovery.

For your claim you must make your discovery, you must record it and then you must stake your 4 corners and "post your notice" on the NE corner post

That would be for a claim on State administered or Federally administered public land.

Joe



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Walt_Anchorage
06:23:35 Sun
Jan 27 2013

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Re: "Discovery" and claim staking

Hi Joe,
I'm with you on the "Discovery" issue. Also I think you could win the "Mr. Fur-face" contest at Fur Rondy if that picture is current.

I hope you guys are doing well. Life is good for me. At least it beats the only other option...

We have been buying property in Arizona getting ready for retirement and haven't spent as much vacation time in remote Alaska as I would like. After I retire I plan to live in Ruby in the summer.

I sold my big airplane, the Six, and had an interest in a 175 Cessna for a while but I sold that. Now I have an airplane that I can borrow when I want. That's even better. I do miss the Six which was almost like a motor home with wings.



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DanAK
06:38:55 Sun
Jan 27 2013

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Re: "Discovery" and claim staking

Yes, You make a discovery then stake a claim. (on state land)

  
geowizard
16:00:10 Sun
Jan 27 2013

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Re: "Discovery" and claim staking

Terry S. Maley, in his "Handbook of Mineral Law", spends 150 pages and cites mining law decisions that go back to 1872.

Discovery includes "marketability". What is a locatable mineral? There are "common" and "uncommon" varieties. What is the test of "economic" value when deciding "valuable mineral" under the "prudent person" test?

Most of the current mining law is based on cases that have nothing to do with precious metals. They were sand and gravel discoveries and oil shale discoveries.

The government would "contest" discovery, if the government had a reason to do so. A rival claimant might contest a discovery - but ask yourself why? If the claim is not valid because of insufficient marketable mineral that a prudent person would mine, then the same would hold true for them! :confused:

- Geowizard
[1 edits; Last edit by geowizard at 16:02:09 Sun Jan 27 2013]

  
geowizard
16:14:21 Sun
Jan 27 2013

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Re: "Discovery" and claim staking


Furthermore...

Validity of discovery based on economic value;

Who did the sampling?

How much was sampled?

Who controlled the samples?

Who performed the assays?

Were all of those people qualified to perform those tasks and were the resulting calculations of marketability done according to a recognized and approved process?

In order to contest "discovery" in a court of law the cost of the exercise would be enormous and furthermore futile. A rival claimant would gain nothing. The government in a goverment action would gain the other use of the land.

- Geowizard

  
geowizard
17:23:56 Sun
Jan 27 2013

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Re: "Discovery" and claim staking

Food for thought...

IF Recreational mining is not "commercial", it is not expected to be profitable and almost never is, so... almost always never is and never has been a "Valid" discovery based on requirement of "economic deposit".

Therefore, a "recreational miner" cannot be expected to ever make a valid discovery!

Many of my friends are recreational miners. They have mining claims. I have asked them on occasion, have you ever thought about opening a commercial mining operation?

No - just doing it for fun. :smile:

- Geowizard
[2 edits; Last edit by geowizard at 17:26:20 Sun Jan 27 2013]

  
overtheedge
20:11:01 Sun
Jan 27 2013

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Re: "Discovery" and claim staking

Perhaps this will help clarify the prudent man issue:

US v Jerry E Franklin ILBA 86-424 22 Sept 1987 in Oregon.

In this case, there was an actual mine in existence.
eric

  
geowizard
21:08:06 Sun
Jan 27 2013

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Re: "Discovery" and claim staking

ote,

An excellent example of the legal process.

Here's a direct link:

http://www.oha.doi.gov/IBLA/Ibladecisions/099IBLA/099IBLA120%20U.%20S.%20v.%20FRANKLIN,%20JERRY%209-22-1987.pdf

The claimant lost the case. The Gov won. Again, it's a good example of a case where the government doesn't have to explain their "motive".:gonetoofar:

- Geowizrd

  
overtheedge
23:35:48 Sun
Jan 27 2013

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Re: "Discovery" and claim staking

And lest anyone misunderstand, this transpired before an administrative judge as do most others.

The administrative judge position is a bit of an oddity. They basically work under the Executive branch of the government, not directly under the Judicial.

This is the type of judge you see when the IRS pops you. You pay the price first and then you can appeal/contest.
eric

  

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