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Cragx
23:21:47 Wed
Oct 27 2004

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Re: Cosmic County

We need a new moderator, you want to step up to the glory job?

Rod

  
Nick_Clow
23:25:50 Wed
Oct 27 2004

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Re: Cosmic County

> (myself and a few others) are planning on looking after rebolting issues and funds in the future.

Mr K, in view of your comments/opinions (v. early in the thread) about Cosmic that sounds very encouraging.

Whilst I am not prepared to donate money to Mitch so he can retro-bolt (oh sorry - 'renew') climbs, I would be prepared to chip in for anger-management classes for him.
[1 edits; Last edit by Nick_Clow at 02:45:39 Thu Oct 28 2004]

  
Josh_C
23:43:22 Wed
Oct 27 2004

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Re: Cosmic County

i would offer my services but i dont want to give up the 'rock god' title....while you may not appreciate the work that mitch does, or the way he expresses opinions about that work, he has some good points- the reason bolts were placed in the first instance was to make a fall safe, and if it has been determined that these original bolts are not longer up to the job (whether they've seen accidents in the past or not!) then they need replacing- ok i think we all agree on that...but heres an illustration for ya (oh i llov illustrations)
you buy a new WRX but while heading up the mountains it has an overheating problem that causs substantial engine wear (hey steve how's the baby?) so when the engine get toward the end of its working life, you go and trade it in, but make sure its another one with an overheating problem, because on the way up to the mountains this problem has been cause for many memorable epics which you dont want to change....

  
Josh_C
23:47:20 Wed
Oct 27 2004

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Re: Cosmic County

i see where you're coming from nick, i do understand what you're saying...i havent climbed at the county so obviously you have a better idea of whats what, but is it true that there a some bolts where the position makes them dangerous?

  
Cragx
00:03:07 Thu
Oct 28 2004

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Re: Cosmic County

One mans dangerous clip is another man bold run out, depends were you are coming from Josh.

Gotta say, all Mitch was trying to do was organise a proper re-bolting effort, and I for one I thank him for it. You might not have agreed with it, but I certainly donít think anything he did was bad for climbing, where as, if a bolt fails it definitely will be.

Not only was he re-bolting, but he was actively involved with liasing with the council, going to meetings, while most people sat on their arses hoping for things to happen.

One of the reasons I tend to develop new areas, rather than put up routes in existing areas is because I just donít want to get involved in the grubby, snippy local politicsí that is prevalent through out the Australian climbing seen. Be it caused by tall poppy syndrome, rebelling against authority or just plain stubbornness, Iíd rather distance myself and enjoy climbing for what it is... a fun sport... and not some pissing contest over wether a bolt should be placed here or 1 metre to the right.

Thanks Mitch for your work in the past and anything you do in the future, and to anyone else that bothers to spend there own time and/or money trying to fix past wrongs, make a bolt safer or simply add a new climb for other to enjoys.

Itís a thankless task, not ego driven, but very much appreciated by a majority of the climbing community in general.

  
Josh_C
00:06:31 Thu
Oct 28 2004

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Re: Cosmic County

ay ay!

  
shawkshaw
00:47:19 Thu
Oct 28 2004

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Re: Cosmic County

Kyle what ever form the new look rebolting fund take climbing anchors has some donations and some climbing anchor contributions that will be avaliable.

sorry to hear your leaving mitch.

  
jono_g
01:42:32 Thu
Oct 28 2004

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Re: Cosmic County

Hi all
I have been following this thread and thought I would have an input.
Cosmic is an awesome crag and I have had some of my best experiences there. I have also been humbled on numerous occasions and been forced to back off on a carrot. To me this is part of cosmics appeal, many routes require a certain commitment.
I can't climb harder than 21 so I dont think I can comment on the harder routes. But I dont find clipping carrots on routes such as Clip or Die to be that difficult as its not steep. My feeling is that ringbolts on the climbs that are not overhung will affect the atmosphere at Cosmic.

Although my opinions may be different to the majority of the people doing the work. I recognize the value of the rebolting which is being done, keep up the good work, but remember not all climbers prefer to clip ring bolts.

When I wished to do some bolting Mitch was happy to pass on his knowledge and also lend me his glue gun. It is a shame that someone who has given up so much of his time to make climbs safer and be an activist for access, has not recived the appreciation he desereves.
Good work Mitch
Thanks CragX for the opportunity to put my veiws forward
Jono

  
chris_coghill
03:40:11 Thu
Oct 28 2004

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Re: Cosmic County

Somebody just posted a photo of a rockfall at Cosmic yestereday over I'd Rather Be Sailing.... possibly wiping out one of the classic aretes of the mountains, as well as Hollow Men, Toyland, Gentleman's Drag!
Is this a bad omen? Maybe we're all going to hell!
Maybe just some disgruntled old trad climbers deciding that there'll be no rings or no climb at all!
On the plus side, there's a new wall at cosmic county just dying to be gridbolted! (only joking).

  
Nick_Clow
05:32:17 Thu
Oct 28 2004

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Re: Cosmic County

:smile:
Chris,
Quite, how er..ironic is it?!?

God is angry with us for our stupid bickering and has taken away our cliff and climbs to teach us a lesson.

The lesson is: we need to learn to love each other and be friends. (Grrrrrr...)
[1 edits; Last edit by Nick_Clow at 05:36:34 Thu Oct 28 2004]

  
Mrkyle
22:50:45 Thu
Oct 28 2004

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Re: Cosmic County

Sorry, moderation is not my thing.

Thanks for the offer Steve. Will be in touch in due course.


  
WingYing
00:30:13 Fri
Oct 29 2004

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Re: Cosmic County

Whilst I am not prepared to donate money to Mitch so he can retro-bolt (oh sorry - 'renew') climbs, I would be prepared to chip in for anger-management classes for him. [/quote]

Nick, why are you associating Mitch with reto-bolting. He's not the only one in the Mtns who's done "rebolting". Chris Coghill and a few others have done some too. Now that Mitch quits, does that mean you would put more support in rebolting?

If you have put your time and effort into something that you really believe in doing and people around you just sit and watch, or even doing nothing but criticise, I think you would be angry too, Nick.

I'm surprised that Mitch did what he was doing for that long. For the 2 years that I've been with him, I've tried to help out whatever I could financially. So to be blunt, I own some of the bolts that were put in for rebolting. And I'm glad people are clipping them, instead of some tatty old carrots/ half worn down rings from toproping. I'm not saying that all carrots are dangerous, but some of them are F#$Ked. I never get involved in discussions about too many bolts at Shipley, trad/ sports, etc ... And I'm not taking sides either, however, when I looked at my credit card statement for the past 2 years, I've put in quite a bit for rebolting. And I get quite offended when people who doesn't contribute anything, but complain and criticise. Yet they all clip the bloody bolts!!! :ohwell: And I'm not the only one who had contributed financially, Chris Coghill, Nathan, to name a few.

Yes, Mitch is infamous and doesn't have much PR skills. (sorry Mitch, just a personal opinion) But the guy did do some good work in attending council meetings, keep the climbing community informed about access issues, etc ... Be the information he provided was accurate/ inaccurate at times, at least in the process the climbing community becomes more aware. The work that he emphasised in doing is the vital part, not him. He could get run over by a car tomorrow and there'll be no more Mitch Warren, however the issues of access, etc will still be there. But WHAT ARE WE DOING ABOUT THEM? How are you contributing to the issues?

If it took landslides to destroy the climbs that the climbing community cherished, to make us realise that we need some sort of unity and to do something, then so be it. Destroy all of them, I'd say.

The whinging Chinese/ Asian

Jess/ Wing-Ying

  
hipdos
01:54:36 Sat
Oct 30 2004

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Re: Cosmic County

> as i can tell no one has ever raised the idea of installing new bolts to replace existing gear placements.

This is a good point! Are people getting hot under the collar here because they think gear placements are going to be bolted? I hope not. This thread is all about whether rings should replace carrots, and whether some relatively minor adjustments to the bolt placements are warranted. 90 % of this discussion has been thoughtful and worthwhile, let's not get caught up in the 10 % that has not...

  
mikepatt
22:00:41 Tue
Jun 21 2005

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Re: Cosmic County

Now the dust of the rockfall and frantic keyboard bashing has settled Cosmic is once again the sleepy crag it's been for a while now. I was out there last Sunday and we had the place to ourselves. After bumbling up my usualy quota of vegatated grade 14 trad routes I went up to have a look at Allied Chemical News. Thanks for the new bolts Julian, although I didn't think the fixed hanger was necessary. After a few trad leads the climb feels well protected and a big thank you for NOT installing lower off rings. Personally I consider sitting down for a top belay and LOOKING OUT at the view a very satisfying way to finish a climb; no quick lower off and "your turn next". OK it may not be the quickest, most efficient way to climb but at least it makes you pause, take in your surroundings and realise how lucky we are to have fantastic crags in great surrounds often all to ourselves. Or was everyone else queuing for climbs down at Nowra??

  
Duncan101
08:18:39 Wed
Jun 22 2005

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Re: Cosmic County

I was out there last Wednesday too. It really is an awesome crag, and on a still sunny winter's day its gorgeous. A question though: on the allied chemical news wall there is two lines of bolts, one going left onto the arete, the other right. The right one feels about 18, and the left closer to 16 (both are very good). It has been some time since I was last on a rope though. Which one is Allied Chemical News?

  
chris_coghill
00:45:15 Thu
Jun 23 2005

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Re: Cosmic County

The left hand one is Julian's new route that he bolted when he rebolted ACN.
I forgot the name.

  
Duncan101
01:39:11 Thu
Jun 23 2005

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Re: Cosmic County

Cheers. Its a good route and definitely easier than ACN. Thanks also to Julian for rebolting.

  
Cragx
02:55:13 Thu
Jun 23 2005

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Re: Cosmic County

Its in the new climbs database,

Climb Name Thailand Taxidriver
Grade 16
Height 15
FA J. Andersen
Description Start as for The Allied Chemical News, Pitch 2.
From 1st Bolt on TACN go left and up wall. 3 more BR'S and optional #2Camalot. Belay as for TACN. Walk off
Date FA 8/2004

  
xCraiginator
04:48:06 Sun
Nov 21 2010

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Re: Cosmic County

Can I be a moderator. I am the perfect candidate for the job. Respect my authoritar. :smash:

  

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