SORC Rule Change
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mrnice
01:10:04 Fri
Nov 11 2011
SORC Rule Change
The SORC Board of Directors has established the following changes which will be published in the updated 2012 rule book:


Page 10., (1.) Drivers .......class. First time SORC drivers cannot enter a class higher than 105 MPH.

Page 10., (2.) Cars must be capable of acquiring a speed of 155 MPH in the One Mile Shoot Out to qualify for the 120 MPH Class and 140 MPH for the Half Mile Shoot Out.

Page 10., (3.) Cars must be capable of acquiring a speed of 145 MPH in the One Mile Shoot Out to qualify for the 115 MPH Class and 130 MPH for the Half Mile Shoot Out.

Page 10. 9. A Snell Foundation 2005 helmet is the minimum standard for the 100, 105, 110, and 115 MPH Class. A Snell Foundation SA 2010 helmet is required for the 120 and 140 Invitational Classes.

Page 10., 9. (A.) A SORC approved neck restraint is required for the 120 and 140 Invitational Classes.

Page 12., 8. (C.) A SORC approved neck restraint is required for the Unlimited Class.

Page 15. 8. (B.) The navigator must be 18 years of age at the start of the event.

Page 16., 15. (D.) Any entry finishing the event with an average speed which exceeds the class target speed by 5 MPH or more will be disqualified.

Mr. Nice:wave:
car54
06:03:58 Sat
Nov 12 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
gentlemen

I agree with the new rule changes. I especially agree with those that mandate a certain level of performance to run the faster classes. In actual fact, a faster car is the safer car for most speed classes. The slower your car the faster you have to run the corners.

Performance is king.

Ray:wave:
Chris_Bischof
18:23:10 Sat
Nov 12 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
These sound like sensible rules and should make things safer.

The only gaps I see is there is still a huge jump from 105 to 120... and 105 doesn't really prepare someone for the 120. The 110 doesn't really adequately prepare a driver for the 120.

Running the 115 maybe should be mandatory before running the 120.
mrnice
00:07:26 Sun
Nov 13 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
Hello Mr. Chris_,

Drivers are required to successfully the 115 Class before they can enter the 120. One of the corrections to the 2012 rule book that will be made is page 10 in the first paragraph. It should say that one must complete the 115 before entering the 120 rather than the 115.

Everyone should know that we reserve the right to determine what class a driver will enter. If the race director has concerns about the skills of a driver or the adequacy of the car they will not be placed in the selected class. We believe that to err on the side of caution is the best choice. This year greater scrutiny will be given to reviewing the shoot out speeds of cars entered in the 115 and 120 classes. We have had a few slip by in years past which will not happen again.

Mr. Nice :wave:
A_Anderson
14:58:49 Mon
Nov 14 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
These rule changes are all a good idea in my opinion. It helps me justify adding more HP down the road.. :wink:

I do have one question though.. Does this mean the rulebook will also be changed to indicate that competing in the shoot-out is now a mandatory requirement?

-Aaron

mrnice
20:17:27 Mon
Nov 14 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
Hello Mr. Aaron,

By virtue of the fact that we have required speeds that attained to enter the 115 or 120 class the answer to your question is mostly, yes. When I say "mostly" it is because if someone is driving a car that we know is capable of meeting the requirement we will give them the okay even if they choose not to run in the shoot out. As an example, if someone enters the 120 class with a C6 ZO6 we know that the car is more than capable of posting the mandated speed and would not be required to enter the shoot out. If there is any doubt about the cars capability in meeting the speed requirement the car will have to prove it.

Mr. Nice :wave:
mrnice
20:20:20 Mon
Nov 14 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
CORRECTED COPY

Hello Mr. Aaron,

By virtue of the fact that we have required speeds that must be attained to enter the 115 or 120 class, the answer to your question is mostly yes. When I say "mostly" it is because if someone is driving a car that we know is capable of meeting the requirement we will give them the okay even if they choose not to run in the shoot out. As an example, if someone enters the 120 class with a C6 ZO6 we know that the car is more than capable of posting the mandated speed and would not be required to enter the shoot out. If there is any doubt about the cars capability in meeting the speed requirement the car will have to prove it.

Mr. Nice :wave:
Toolman
02:36:16 Wed
Nov 16 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
I have seen quite a few C6Z06's not attain 140mph in the half mile.
Version_2
05:36:29 Wed
Nov 16 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
Really? That is odd isn't it?
mrnice
17:35:16 Wed
Nov 16 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
Dear Mr. Verson_2,

What is odd is that the SORC records for the last two years do not support Mr. Toolman's statement. If a ZO6 does not brake the 140 mark then neither the car nor the driver should me in the 120 class

Mr. Nice:wave:
Version_2
18:58:10 Wed
Nov 16 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
With my 4350# sled, I almost got to 140, so they should hit 145? easy.
car_2
22:08:05 Wed
Nov 16 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
maybe the reason the z06 could not hit 140 was because it was pulling a camper or a rack of hay?

they do that in these parts you know!


Ralph_Denison
00:13:01 Fri
Nov 18 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
I agree, sensible rules indeed. Although I think each car in the higher classes should be evaluated on a per car (and driver) basis and not just on reaching a certain straight line speed requirement.
Chris_Bischof
03:14:10 Fri
Nov 18 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
130/140 in the 1/2 might be a little high for a barrier to entry (the Mile speeds are reasonable) but its better to error on the side of caution.

My car only ran 130.9 in the 1/2... and is a tank on hard tires, but it doesn't have too much problem averaging 115.

Something lighter and sportier could probably get away with only running 125 in the 1/2 and be fine in the 115.

Rather than complain about the rules, though, people should suck it up and make their cars faster.
Toolman
05:14:46 Tue
Nov 22 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
Quote: mrnice at 17:35:16 Wed Nov 16 2011

Dear Mr. Verson_2,

What is odd is that the SORC records for the last two years do not support Mr. Toolman's statement. If a ZO6 does not brake the 140 mark then neither the car nor the driver should me in the 120 class

Mr. Nice:wave:


Perhaps the air was better the last two years, but I have personally witnessed a number of sub-140mph 1/2mile passes from stock C6Z's. J
And just because the car is capable does not make the driver so. Which was my point.
mrnice
16:39:29 Tue
Nov 22 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
Dear Mr. Toolman,

I don't know where you saw sub-140 passes with a C6 Z06 but it was not here. The fact that someone driving a new Z06 could not attain the minimum 1/2 mile speed tells me that the driver is certainly not capable of entering the 120. Regardless, myself and Clay Mohr will review every entry into the Grand Sport Class this year. No one will slip through without meeting the speed requirements.

Mr. Nice :wave:
Toolman
19:14:58 Tue
Nov 22 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
Well, the only half mile shootout in the country is the SORC, at the least, it is the only one I have attended, and I have compiled ordered lists in the past, ranking all speeds from slowest to fastest, and indeed there was more than one C6Z on those lists whose speed in the half was under 140. I have no need to fantasize about it.

Toolman
19:38:25 Tue
Nov 22 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
The results from 2007 seem to agree with statement. Of the 9 vettes slower than 141, some were indeed C6Z's.
mrnice
20:56:57 Tue
Nov 22 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
It is time to be specific. Put a number on the cars you are referring to or be mute. Only one ZO6 (Ken Hodges) failed to meet the 140 mark in 2007 and it was because of mechanical problems. So what are the car numbers of the ones that you "witnessed a number of sub-140mph 1/2mile passes from stock C6Z's?" The official results from 2007-2011 do not support your claim.

Mr. (Not So) Nice:smash:
Toolman
22:56:41 Tue
Nov 22 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
I was unaware of any mechanical problems with Kens car, and if indeed he was the only ZO6 of those remaining 8 Vettes, I stand corrected.

My ordered list (taken from the official results) is no longer on the site, I will go back and check my book. Of course, I do not have in my notes the mechanical worthiness of every competitor, so I may provide yet more inaccurate reporting. Perhaps we can ask for those types of notes to be included on the official results.

Toolman
23:51:23 Tue
Nov 22 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
Ken have mechanical problems again in 2011? Twice he failed to reach 140 in the half mile.

In 2010, Denny Powell's 07Z never got past 135. Goldbergs first try did not net him a 140. Just between those three names, we have TEN sub 140 passes. If you like, I can spend another 5 minutes researching and probably come up with a few more.

mrnice
01:26:19 Wed
Nov 23 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
You have supported your claim, sort of. Do you know the difference between a Grand Sport and a ZO6? I think not as Goldberg did not drive a ZO6. Spend some more time and see what else you can come up with as my hard copy does not match the on line results. My sheet showed Denny Powell driving a C5 50th Anniversary Corvette. Upon review I have learned that he was driving a ZO6 in 2010. Congratulations, you have shown that if a ZO6 does not make the 140 mark it is not because of the cars performance.

Mr. (Not So) Nice :smash:
Toolman
04:05:18 Wed
Nov 23 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
I was not there in person for Goldberg, only read that he was in a borrowed ZO6. my bad.

As far as a ZO6 not being able to make 140 in the half, never said it was the cars fault.

Too much time in those fiberglass tubs and the fumes get to you Mr Nice, be careful! :smile:



Toolman
13:17:01 Thu
Nov 24 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
That was not the emoticon I was going for! :spinsmile:
Chris_Bischof
02:24:51 Fri
Nov 25 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
Goldberg ran a supercharged Callaway GS. It should have run over 140 in the 1/2 mile and did on his later runs.
Charlie_Friend
05:37:36 Fri
Nov 25 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
I hope I don't sound like I'm whining......but is it really necessary to require a later model helmet for the 120 and 140 invitational classes??? The tech speeds for many of the other ("slower") classes is the same 140 mph. Also (OK maybe I'm whining now) the only time I use my helmet is for ORR. I run all four events and I actually wear my helmet less than 1 hour per event. So that equates to way less than 4 hours of use a year. Even after 5 years of use that is less than 20 hours of use. Just seems like kind of an unnecessary expense to me.
Ralph_Denison
14:18:45 Sat
Nov 26 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
Charlie, there is an easy solution to your problem....Race more!:wink:
Rusher_Racing
20:24:25 Thu
Dec 8 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
I think the new rules are a good thing things change overtime and keeping the event safe is an important thing.


But can we get a list of the SORC approved head and neck restraint systems?

HAN's
D'fender etc?
Just curious what qualify's and what doesn't. The dirt track guys have some cheaper options such as the isaac link etc..


I have been holding out on buying one for a few years now and this might be the final nudge I need.
mrnice
20:36:37 Thu
Dec 8 2011
Re: SORC Rule Change
Dear Mr. Rusher Racing,

Thanks for bringing up such a good question. It was so obvious that we did not see the proverbial forest. We will try and answer this quickly.

Mr. Nice:wave:
jhepburn
04:53:20 Tue
May 8 2012
Re: SORC Rule Change
I received the 2012 rulebook today. I was surprised to see there were quite a few changes compared to the 2010 rulebook which is posted on the SORC homepage.

My question is in regards to being a first time driver and running the mile. From what I am reading (page 10) this is not an option. Is my understanding correct on this? Say I tech'd for 140, I am only allowed to run the 1/2 mile being a first-year driver?


mrnice
05:54:05 Tue
May 8 2012
Re: SORC Rule Change
Hello Mr. Jhepburn,

"I am only allowed to run the 1/2 mile being a first-year driver?" One half mile is the answer to your question.

Mr. Nice:wave:
car_2
17:54:26 Tue
May 8 2012
Re: SORC Rule Change
Joe,

I am curious why Drag radials are not allowed in the street class?

I would never run them up the road, only for the half/mile.


W_Kuiper
02:55:06 Wed
May 9 2012
Re: SORC Rule Change
Mr. Nice,

I quote: "p. 15.8 (B) The navigator must be 18 years of age at the start of the event"

Shouldn't it say "or older" after the number 18? My nav has not been 18 for quite a few years. heh heh.

Grand Phooey
mrnice
16:48:35 Fri
May 11 2012
Re: SORC Rule Change
Dear Mr. Car_2,

If I recall correctly the advise we received was not to use drag radials in a long duration high speed event like the mile. Also, it was thought since it is a class for "street cars" drag radials do not fit the criteria for street use.

Mr. Nice :wave:
mrnice
16:55:41 Fri
May 11 2012
Re: SORC Rule Change
Dear Mr. Grand Phooey,

Thanks very much bring this to my attention. Perhaps you should @(^$)+@&^%# and then %$&+!3=. Thank you.

Mr. Nice:wave:
Version_2
20:16:22 Fri
May 11 2012
Re: SORC Rule Change
Who will know unless you take off as fast as an Audi Quatro!
Chris_Bischof
14:34:21 Sun
May 20 2012
Red Flag Rule Change Documentation Request.
While on the Subject of rule changes, could the board look into writing a rule for what happens to timing/scoring in the event of a red flag and whether or not green flag runs will be counted.

The Un-official rule now appears to be that if 8 cars in a class make Green flag north/south runs, but 2 cars in the class get a red flag for one leg of the run, The 8 cars that ran green only get scored on 1 run, and they don't get to pick which of the runs that was.

This differs from what was done in the past so some clarifying might need to be done.

The "Everybody gets a Red" may be in the spirit of "fairness", but it also "pisses off" 8 people instead of 2 people... and especially if it was some noob in the back of their class (that maybe shouldn't have even been in their class) that caused the red flag.

Hopefully there won't be any more red flags, but if one happens to occur in the future, it would be good to have a rule written down.

Either :

1) All Green runs count. If you are unlucky enough to get Red Flagged on a Leg, your Green run on your other Leg is your average. The "Deal with it" or "That's Racin'" Option.

2) If one Car is red Flagged in a Class, None of the Runs of that leg in that class count - (the 2011 rule) The "It is Only Fair" Option.

Or

3) If a leg is red Flagged, the closest to perfect is used -Both runs OR one run (the non red flagged leg, just as the Red Flagged Cars would do). This is the "Who Crashed?" or "Maybe I Got Lucky once" Option (depending on which option they select).


By having a written rule that everyone knows, there won't be endless debates about what to do on Saturday Night after the race... you implement the rule and you brush off your hands.

Under the "It's only Fair" Scenario, the Guy who CAUSED the red flag could actually win the Class... It's only fair.




W_Kuiper
03:51:04 Fri
Jun 1 2012
Re: Red Flag Rule Change Documentation Request.
Dearest Mr. Nice,

During the past days I have spent quality time, possibly as much as five minutes, considering your kind and thoughtful response, above, to my suggestion regarding your statement that "The navigator must be 18 years of age at the start of the event." Even though I do not fully understand the language in which you are attempting to communicate your thoughts, nor am I familiar with your method of grammatical construction, I believe that a kind and sensitive individual of such experience and advanced age as yourself would only speak in the kindest and most complimentary of terms. Believing, then, that you received gratefully my suggestion to add the words "or older" after the number 18 in rule 15.8 (B), I thank you for your comments and accept them with all of the respect and admiration that they deserve. Possibly you would prefer to add the words "at least" before the number 18 in said rule. I humbly leave this decision up to your mature discretion. May you enjoy health, wealth and happiness in the coming weeks and months. I look forward to seeing you in August and continuing our wonderful game of cars.

Respectfully yours,

Grand Phooey
Version_2
22:34:30 Sun
Jun 3 2012
Re: Red Flag Rule Change Documentation Request.
So is this the "Rule Change" hash thread then?


SORC Rule Change
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