Caselman, anyone?
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Tbkahuna
06:20:18 Mon
Dec 29 2008
Caselman, anyone?
I have finally started on mine. So far, so good. Has anyone else built one, or at least made any parts?

I have the trigger housing, the bolt and bolt body, striker follower body, and spring guide built.

I gave spring winding a try and it is working out great. The first attempts were for the bolt springs. They are 5 1/4" long, .031" wire, with a 5/16" ID. They look quite "professional" even though they were wound with a hand drill while I was sitting on the floor watching TV.

If anyone wants to trade building ideas and stories let me know. I am keeping an updated list on the "plans" corrections and updates based on what I have seen and built.

Tbkahuna
17:40:40 Mon
Dec 29 2008
Re: Caselman, anyone?
The bolt, the bolt body, and the spring guide are at the top.

The striker follower is right below that. I added a third hold down screw as you can see in the picture. That is how the Caselman I saw looked. The plans show the slot in the wrong location.

The receiver tube and the trigger housing are at the bottom. The radiused blocks are in the trigger housing and mounted in their actual position. The slots on the bottom of the receiver housing are for the trigger and a window to weld the tank holder/valve. The magazine goes where the cut out is on the trigger housing at the left behind the silver screw head. The receiver slots are all finished except for the side one for the striker.



Tbkahuna
16:34:43 Sat
Jan 3 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Here is a bolt spring I wound and the couple of things you need to wind them. This one used .031 music wire and was wound sitting on the floor using the hand drill.

I never expected them to come out this good!



Tbkahuna
16:38:34 Sat
Jan 3 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
It even worked really well with .055" diameter wire winding the striker spring. It is .720" ID and 10.25" long. You can see my first attempt with some extra wire coiled on the end. I had to figure out how to do this on the mini lathe. The chuck spins freely in either direction, so I had to control it so it wouldn't let the wire go slack.

Winding the springs was a fun experience. Now I will never have to worry about not being able to find just the right spring!



caselmanproject
23:58:33 Mon
Jan 26 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Hi, very happy of even another follower of the caselman bb machine gun. I will follow your Threads with interest.

Scuse me from my english....Im french!

Tbkahuna
16:51:57 Tue
Jan 27 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Hi Caselmanproject,

Yes, it is good to hear of others with the same interest. I am making a lot of progress and can see the end in sight!!

Have you started making any parts? I would love to see any work you have going and discuss any issues.

TBK

caselmanproject
21:42:31 Tue
Jan 27 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I gathered some parts, but, I gather as much possible information on the projects.

There are errors on the plan, but , for me which must all translate….:sad: I tests to target the problems future as much as possible.

Is for this reason that I waits with great interest the evolution of your work :smile:


caselmanproject
22:28:57 Tue
Jan 27 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I found this picture and this video which proves well that the caselman Machinegun work. The creator name is in fact, Jeff Castelman.






video


Tbkahuna
18:13:53 Wed
Jan 28 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I am making corrections to my "plans" as I go along. If you have any specific questions, just ask. I'll let you know what I have found out.

Yes, I have met Jeff, and have held the gun shown on the table in your second picture.



caselmanproject
02:38:03 Thu
Jan 29 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Quote: Tbkahuna at [unixtime


Yes, I have met Jeff, and have held the gun shown on the table in your second picture.



I hope that you will put some pic of the corrections on the plans.


How much error you found?

Tbkahuna
19:22:01 Thu
Feb 5 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
If you build it according to the dimensions, you will have some problems. I am also making updates from the original plans.

The pictures show a third screw holding the striker to the striker follower. Not an error, but only two 6-32 screws did seem a little weak for the only connection holding a striker banging away at 700 rpm.

As an example, the striker follower shows a 3/16" slot cut at a dimension of 9/16" as I remember. It should be 7/16". If you cut it to the dimension on the plans, 9/16", it won't work at all. Measure twice, cut once!!

TBK



caselmanproject
15:44:12 Sat
Feb 7 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I take in note, thank you. You will put picture of evolution?

Is your first project of the kind? My only strong point in the field is that I am welder. :rolleyes:
You have another document or just the plan of 28 pages , not much information on the Web, and little believes that its work.
:sad:




Tbkahuna
17:04:59 Sat
Feb 7 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I will try to take some pictures of some things today.

I only have the plans that you can find on the internet. I studied them pretty well before cutting metal, and also as I am making parts.

Once I have it completed, tested and working, I will put together all of my notes and drawings on doing it.

I build all kinds of things. I am building this one since it is so much more powerful than the Drozd and Strafer type guns.

Welding skills will be very helpful.

Put some pictures up of what you have. I look forward to seeing what others have done, too.

TBK



Tbkahuna
21:51:13 Sat
Feb 7 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
caselmanproject,

Since you are a welder, do you have any thoughts on the welding of the valve base to the receiver?

Since that will take the hammering, I would think it would easily develop cracks in the weld if no heat treating was done. I am going to try without heat treat only until I have it working then will heat treat. I don't have a furnace that could handle the size of the receiver, so I will have to find somewhere to get that done.

TBK







Tbkahuna
22:18:46 Sat
Feb 7 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Here is a picture of the striker follower showing where the slot goes. The dimensions on the plans would put it too far towards the outside of the part (further towards the bottom in my picture) and it wouldn't work.



I took a couple of other pictures I will link here.

TBK

Tbkahuna
23:21:59 Sat
Feb 7 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Here are most of the parts I have completed, or mostly completed.



caselmanproject
20:28:45 Sun
Feb 8 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Quote: Tbkahuna at 21:51:13 Sat Feb 7 2009

caselmanproject,

Since you are a welder, do you have any thoughts on the welding of the valve base to the receiver?
You speak about the firing valve? scuse me, the translator…
Except if you use an electrode special, the treatment termic is not necessary on mild steel.

A picture of the two parts would give me more precision.

Tbkahuna
01:29:44 Tue
Feb 10 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Yes, the firing valve. I thought the DOM tubing had a higher carbon content than it does.

TBK

caselmanproject
00:50:03 Wed
Feb 11 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
A pre-heating would be preferable, if not the welding should contain a nickel alloy to reduce the tension, afterwards, if I remember. an income with 200 degrees during 2 hours.

Tbkahuna
18:42:41 Wed
Feb 11 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I have designed a different magazine and feed system for feeding lead balls. I have built and tested a short version of it and it seems to work. I am waiting for some more steel and tubing to make a full-length version. I will post pictures when it is done.


TBK

caselmanproject
23:46:26 Thu
Feb 12 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Interesting, you thinks improving the performance ?

Tbkahuna
00:12:08 Fri
Feb 13 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I don't think of it as improving performance, but it should make a lot of the build work easier, and I have always had good luck getting something round to feed through a magazine since its orientation is always the same. If everything works, then I can decide if I want or need to use something other than round lead balls. Also, with this, a caliber change will be easy to do. I think that would be great!

I am building the valve, now, and once that and the mags are done I will be finishing up the fire control group operation and will be ready to fire with an external tank hooked to the the valve with a braided hose. I want to get the thing to fire and run, then will decide on a final tank type and attachment. I am strongly leaning towards an external tank and a wooden stock, but don't know how it will work with lower pressure and the pressure drop of a longer hose.

It's fun to see something like this come together out of just a pile of steel!

TBK

caselmanproject
15:33:28 Fri
Feb 13 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I am in a hurry to see the result.

Another picture that I have .









caselmanproject
15:51:51 Fri
Feb 13 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Two types of magazine which could perhaps be appropriate???:ohwell:







caselmanproject
16:04:39 Fri
Feb 13 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I have a picture of the firing valve , that on the SMG , one of the parts differs from much.You know why?





Tbkahuna
12:27:13 Sat
Feb 14 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I didn't think a conventional magazine like shown in your pictures would work with the Caselman so I didn't go that route. The bolt with an o-ring on the end would have to push the bullet through the lips on the magazine and into the chamber without cutting or deforming the the o-ring. Because the magazine spring is pushing up, there would always be a force pushing the bolt into the feed lips. I also looked at just usng a much smaller diameter pin to push bullets out of the magazine, but didn't think I would be able to get enough blowback force with the open magazine in the path of the air and bolt when it blow back.

I am thinking of making some changes to allow a little bit of air to flow back to the front of the 3/4" diameter section on the bolt to help it recock, especially at lower pressure. Increasing the annular space between the bolt probe and the bolt would do that.

I wish it would work, but I couldn't figure out how to reliably do it. If you do, let me know.

Tbkahuna
12:52:31 Sat
Feb 14 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Caselmanproject,

You asked about the differences in the connections to the valve.

I have seen the second picture on the web, as well as some others showing parts made by the same person. In one of those pictures you could see a part made as an apparent improvement on the sheet metal spring guide that goes inside the valve. It was full diameter and had grooves in it for o-rings. Unfortunately, that wouldn't allow air to pass through the valve body. I think that person just didn't understand how the valve works.

Based on that, I am guessing that the person didn't have access to the high pressure fittings shown in your first picture and was trying something else. I am not familiar with that particular fitting, but since it is barbed for a hose attachment, it is probably not good for 3000 psi. However, that setup would be useful for testing and playing around with the valve using shop air at 120 psi or so.

Initially, I am just going to use a high pressure quick disconnect like on other pre-charged airguns or paintball tanks. That way I can use an external air tank to test fire. Once the gun works ok, I will make any changes to match the original Caselman.

TBK



caselmanproject
14:31:20 Sat
Feb 14 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Quote: Tbkahuna at 12:52:31 Sat Feb 14 2009


Initially, I am just going to use a high pressure quick disconnect like on other pre-charged airguns or paintball tanks. That way I can use an external air tank to test fire. Once the gun works ok, I will make any changes to match the original Caselman.

TBK

Probably for the same reason it is put this part.

caselmanproject
21:47:50 Sat
Feb 21 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
which type steel you used for the barrel ?, and the spring?

Tbkahuna
13:41:21 Mon
Feb 23 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I wound all of the springs using tempered music wire. It is a high carbon steel, ASTM 228 specification. It is common music wire that comes in a roll. I unwound about 30 or 40% more than needed, let it uncoil, and went right to winding. I got mine from Enco.

http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=325-4175&PMPXNO=5810375&PARTPG=INLMK3

I also use shorter, straightened, 3 foot lengths that I have from model airplane building, and it works well, too.

The barrel I am using for the first version is a barrel liner that I got from Track of the Wolf. It is the 32-20 barrel. It is 1/2" outside diameter, .305" bore, .312" groove. I don't know the actual material, but I cleaned up the saw cut end on the lathe and it was pretty soft. It won't be welded in my application.

http://www.trackofthewolf.com/(S(p5lkir55rzktokiotnf5i045))/categories/tableList.aspx?catID=14&subID=142&styleID=483

TBK



caselmanproject
22:22:42 Mon
Mar 23 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
whats new Tbk ?

Tbkahuna
15:46:24 Fri
Mar 27 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Nothing major to update. I haven't had any time in the shop for the last month. I hope to soon, though.

I did just get my TIG welder delivered, so once I get set up, I can start putting it all together.

TBK

caselmanproject
22:51:26 Sun
Apr 26 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I'm hurry to see the suite :smile:

caselmanproject
15:25:07 Wed
Jun 24 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
nothing new?:rolleyes:

AMD65
17:37:09 Sun
Jun 28 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Hi Guys

I've been following this thread for a while and I have a few ideas/questions.

I want to use a .45 acp barrel and lighter .45 tips since they can be bought bulk as reloading components. I figure since the .45 doesn't go much faster than 1100fps, the power shouldn't be a problem.

Is this do-able? I want to thicken all the steel by a few mm and use a 20''-ish bull barrel. I'm not a huge fan of the Thompson look and I'll feel a little safer letting off compressed gas with thicker steel. I don't have the tools so I'm going to have this made for me.

Oh and will hollow points cycle in the mechanism and expand with this thing?

caselmanproject
23:27:08 Sat
Jul 11 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
whats new Tbk ?

gotcha12
21:39:01 Thu
Sep 24 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
do you sell it in a kit thanks
please email me back
robbenline@yahoo.com

Tbkahuna
23:50:16 Mon
Nov 16 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I don't sell it as a kit. However, I did send a material list out to a few people at one time. It was a big help getting all the metal in front of me. It was just my list for purchasing the metal, and had enough extra so I could machine it. I'll see if I have that in electronic format. I may have already posted it here, too.

Tbkahuna

Tbkahuna
00:01:36 Tue
Nov 17 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
AMD65,

I sent you an email.

The diameters aren't critical, but the various parts need to fit inside each other. You could easily make the valve body (air chamber) wall thicknesses a little bigger.

There shouldn't be a problem with cycling hollow points. For expansion, it will depend on the hollow point design and the velocity. I don't expect a high velocity, so the expansion would be limited. At 60 ft-lbs or so soft lead will deform, but won't be like a bullet from a centerfire cartridge. Even at 200 or so ft-lbs, the expansion will be limited for a small hollow point cavity. Yes, a large open cavity will deform, but the penetration may not be very good since the energy levels are low compared to cartridge guns. You will be using pure lead or slightly alloyed bullets, not copper jacketed bullets like found for centerfire rounds.



Tbkahuna
06:27:10 Sun
Nov 22 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
I whittled the valve body out of a piece of steel tonight. The little lathe had the big chuck on it when I started cutting the threads. It doesn't have enough low speed torque to cut threads with the much heavier chuck, so I did it by hand. It took a while longer, but the threads mate up very well to the air chamber. I have a little more finish work to do on the inside of the valve body.

Tbkahuna
06:32:17 Sun
Nov 22 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
One of the things I didn't like about the valve setup is that the valve body is welded to the receiver tube, and the air chamber section screws on to it. That would be fine, but there is an attachment to the air chamber from the storage tank. That means you have to locate the input hole and pipe threads correctly when the valve is threaded together.

If it doesn't seal against the o-ring, it will take a while to get those surfaces mated and sealing while maintaining the orentation of the air chamber to the valve body welded to the receiver.

If anyone else is making a Caselman, you'll want to consider that.

TBK

Tbkahuna
21:06:29 Sun
Nov 22 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Here is a picture of the valve body, air chamber, valve and stem.

I spent a while trying to decide on the need for changes to the o-ring setup shown in the drawings. It should be an #015 O-ring, 9/16" ID, 11/16" OD. I considered building the valve body longer than required so I could drill and tap the back of it for a pressure connection to test so I could test the o-ring seal and valve body and air chamber integrity. I skipped that, but now wish I would have allowed for that. I can still test it prior to welding the valve body to the receiver.

Once I get this one to run, I may incorporate some other ideas into the valve body and air chamber design. I want to be able to use various air chamber lengths without having to machine new air chambers. On a mini lathe, it takes a while!!

TBK




Tbkahuna
22:41:27 Sun
Nov 22 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
The o ring fit seems to work ok. I cut the 10 degree taper about .010" deeper into the air chamber. It goes together very smoothly.

I need to drill and tap the air inlet and I will be able to do my preliminary tests with air. I intend to strength and leak test it with vegetable oil to about 2 times the working pressure.

TBK

Tbkahuna
03:19:03 Mon
Nov 23 2009
First Pressure Test a Success
The o-ring is working fine. I have tested it to 500 psi, then to 1000 psi for about 10 minutes each with not a single bubble. I need to set up a better containment area to test it at higher pressures.

TBK

Tbkahuna
12:27:57 Mon
Nov 23 2009
Re: Caselman, anyone?
Cutting the 1/8" NPT threads in the air chamber caused me a small headache. I drilled the hole and reamed it with a tapered reamer before tapping. The depth of that hole is limited by the depth and diameter you can drill without going through the other side of the air chamber. As a result, my tapered reamer barely removed any metal at the top. I could grind the tapered reamer down, but it is the only one I have for 1/8" NPT and I will need it for other things. I made the hole as deep as I dared, but still need to get a little more clearance by drilling out a little more on the inside (down the length of the tube) at that end. I have a 3/16" of 1/4" hole at the very end, of the air tube, but will make it a little bigger. That should add a little clearance for the reamer and tap.

It holds pressure to 1000 psi so far, but I would like to get one or more additional turns on the fitting just to be sure.

TBK

Tbkahuna
23:25:42 Mon
Nov 23 2009
Marching on... 2600 psi pressure test...
My scuba tank was down to 2600 psi, but I was able to shield the valve in case of a rupture for an air test. It held 2600 psi for about 30 minutes. There wasn't even a tiny leak, so I am happy about that.

TBK

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Caselman, anyone?
http://bb.bbboy.net/straferbbmachinegunownersgroup-viewthread?forum=5&thread=49
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