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23 people online in the last 60 minutes - 0 members, 0 anon and 23 guests. (Most ever was 121 at 02:27:28 Wed Oct 19 2011) |
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drozdandconfused  15:22:42 Wed Apr 20 2011 Offline 759 posts BBMG General ****  Reply |
That is a common thing at DealX, the comments say no protection, but the picture shows with PCB (protection). I had an order of 14500's (they are now discontinued) where the dimensions were so far off that the batteries wouldn't fit more than one per side (with dummies and/or Energizers) and they wouldn't work in my Cree flashlights either. After a long PITA they finally gave me store credit after I returned them to their Miami, Fl outpost.
There is another more expensive charger called the Ultrafire WF188. What is nice about this one is it charges most of the 3.6-3.7V Li-ions and also has a 3.2V setting for Lipos. GD has a newer '10 BB and from what I've read they have components which are more compatible with higher voltages and battery compositions than the earlier builds 07-09. Ram, my experience has been that 1250 gives a decent amount of shots per tank and the fps is a respectable high 700's to low 800's. I liked 1400 for single shot or short burst applications for the slightly higher fps and the nice loud POP and slight kick. 1400 full auto you will blow through air quickly. I blew through 3 barrels too quickly for my pocketbook when shooting in the 1200-1400 psi range so lately I've de-tuned the regs I use most to 1000 because I still get 700 fps and it has been a lot easier on my barrels. 12V is fine for all the pressures mentioned, but I prefer 15V because I like the speed that it spins the mag motor. On my gun w/BBmax chip the best set up has been 2 Li-ions and 4 Energizers, with this gun I can only go down from there. My gun w/Sergey's board works well w/2L + 4E, 3L + 3E, 4L + 2E, 4 - 18650's, pretty much anything I put in there except my Red/Black protected Trustfire 14500's. As far as barrel damage is concerned, read through these: http://bb.bbboy.net/straferbbmachinegunownersgroup-viewthread?forum=10&th [ Continued ] View Rest Of Post | ||||
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rkr 13:43:24 Wed Apr 20 2011 Offline 345 posts BBMG Major General ** Reply |
Uhh sorry, but do you mean that the ones I linked are protected and should not be used??? It says "TrustFire 14500 3.7V 900mAh without overcharge and overdischarge circuitry".
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camracer  10:18:51 Wed Apr 20 2011 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000  Reply |
All looks/sounds good rkr. By the way, those ARE protected cell batteries. Buy extra Trustfires so you can keep some charging while shooting with others. ---Cam
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rkr 05:01:56 Wed Apr 20 2011 Offline 345 posts BBMG Major General ** Reply |
Since we were talking of batteries here, let me make sure that I understood correctly what I need if I go to rechargeable alternative.
3 * non-protectec 14500 batteries like these: http://www.dealextreme.com/p/trustfire-14500-3-7v-900mah-rechargeable-lithium-batteries-2-pack-19771 The voltage of these will be from 11.1 to 12.6V For these I'd need a charger like: http://www.dealextreme.com/p/battery-ac-charger-for-2-14500-100-240v-us-plug-36484 Then in addition to these I should use 1-2 regular lithium type 1.5V batteries and 1-2 dummy batteries? The total price seems to be less than 10 * N batteries locally so I'm ready to go if I got it all right. | ||||
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radical  22:26:57 Tue Apr 19 2011 Offline 5155 posts BBMG LIFER  Reply |
Damage to the barrel will likely be at the mouth. In the past, undersized and irregular bb's were the problem-specificly the CopperHead brand. I stripped down the drozd to remove the barrel and other modding and the barrel tore away like a pillsbury dough log. I would expect the same with any steel or zinc bb may be a problem at these higher rof. The problem would be specifically at the breach which would likely give b4 the rest of the barrel would.
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green_dots 21:40:52 Tue Apr 19 2011 Offline 2392 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
I have no reason why but my Blackbird opereates just fine with 16-21 volts. It turns on and fires.I keep usually ay less than 15.4 volts because of Sergey's advice.I did have a problem at first getting it to turn on but fooled with it and put it down to a connection problem.I never put the trust fires in first and the start up problem disappeared. GD.
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rkr 16:37:00 Tue Apr 19 2011 Offline 345 posts BBMG Major General ** Reply |
Talking of barrel damage and 1200rpm kind of reminds me of the MG42. Could it be that the barrel is overheating from all the friction and pounding of those BBs?
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Ramatam 16:18:59 Tue Apr 19 2011 Offline 30 posts BBMG Corporal Reply |
DnC are you saying that it might be better to drop down to 1200 psi for less wear and tear on the barrel threads/breech? I'd be happy to do that as opposed to tearing things up. And I am guessing that 12+V will be good at that setting?
What battery config. is making you happy these days? Thanks Ram | ||||
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drozdandconfused 15:53:08 Tue Apr 19 2011 Offline 759 posts BBMG General **** Reply |
As cam points out, 12.6V will open the valve w/1400 psi and I would consider that the minimum to open the valve completely. 15V will open it and spin the mag fast enough to keep up with 1200 rpm sustained burst.
I'm not recommending mixes compositions, but I have shot a lot with the 2-3 Li-ions, + 3-4 Ultimate Liths and checked them repeatedly right after and never felt any heat. Excessive heat BAD! I haven't had good luck with the protected Li-ions either, the inboard chip seems to shut down when turning on the gun as there is a slight spike at that moment (I hooked up a multi meter and ran some test a while ago). I made some dummies out of aluminum rod a while back but wasn't happy with the performance of Li-ions and dummies only. There was a post of some new dummies recently that looked promising. If anyone tried those, give a shout, I'm curios to know how they worked. If your going to shoot 1200-1400 psi or more, use steel bbs, and fire full auto sustained burst, there is a very good chance it will trash the breach of your barrel. It can be as soon as 5 - 10,000 shots with the higher psi. Check mag head alignment. | ||||
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Capt_Thomas 13:24:36 Tue Apr 19 2011 Offline 104 posts BBMG Colonel Reply |
For Ram or any of you guys looking to learn about batteries, mixing different chemistries, actual sizes / electrical specs etc. I would like to suggest the folowing links:
http://batteryuniversity.com/ http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/forum.php Candle Power is a great source for not only flash lights, lasers, electrical parts / info & every type of battery and charger you could think of! Hope these are helpful. Capt. Thomas | ||||
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camracer 10:36:39 Tue Apr 19 2011 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
12.6v will do the job, Ram.
The 3.7v 14500 trustfire batteries charge to 4.2v. And Energizer lithiums fresh are about 1.8v Keep that in mind when choosing combo's! 2 Trustfire, 3 Energizer lith's and a dummy battery would get you 13.8v thereabouts. For 1400 psi, you'll notice the difference in power opening the valve the higher you can push voltage. Don't waste your money on non-rechargeables! You'll go through them quick! ---Cam
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Ramatam 18:53:41 Mon Apr 18 2011 Offline 30 posts BBMG Corporal Reply |
So as I get closer to getting my rig set up to HPA, I still have a couple of nagging questions.
Let me just list them for quick answers, I know that the max. V with the stock board is around 15.3V... (3 xeno and 3 Ultras) What is the MINIMUM voltage be to shoot at 1400psi? 3 rechargeable 14500's and 3 dummy batteries that would give me 12.6V. is this enough? 3 14500's + 1Ultra + a dummy would give me 14.1V...better? I think DnC uses 2 14500's with 4 Ultras at 1250psi @ 14.4V...best? any mixing issues there? Just trying to get a handle on what I need ...want good velocity but don't want to throw money away with Voltage over kill thanks for the help. Ram | ||||
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Ramatam 17:49:07 Mon Apr 18 2011 Offline 30 posts BBMG Corporal Reply |
Whoops, I made a mistake....don't know why I did that but I did NOT get a regulator...just the K-valve. sorry for the error. Still a good deal though...
KP | ||||
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drozdandconfused 15:51:30 Mon Apr 18 2011 Offline 759 posts BBMG General **** Reply |
That's good news, thanks for the tip. Sounds like they're much better for both applications, i.e., shooting and diving. | ||||||
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Ramatam 14:34:45 Mon Apr 18 2011 Offline 30 posts BBMG Corporal Reply |
Uh...not DnD....DnC...sorry
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Ramatam 13:48:17 Mon Apr 18 2011 Offline 30 posts BBMG Corporal Reply |
Hi guys,
Drozdandconfused said that he didn't think you could get a super 80/3300 any more. I've got good news. Catalina cylinders makes one for scuba. I had one delivered this weekend, which is called the C80 rated at 3300psi(as opposed to the S80/3000psi). They are more expensive but I got mine at cheapscuba.com with a regulator with a VIP sticker, an up- to-date hydro and 3300 psi rated K-valve for around 135.00 (plus 25.00 shipping) that's a very good price. They are around 117.00 without the valve. They are made form the newer high strength aluminum alloy 6061-T6 which negates the need for eddy current testing at hydro...and no more stress cracks that DnD experienced. and if you dive with it...these tanks are neutral boyancy all the way to empty...S80's are postive bouyancy when half full. Passing that along. | ||||
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camracer 00:40:18 Fri Apr 15 2011 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
Well, DnC, you have more proof for the point than me. I have only one make of reg (Ninja). You have more. I wonder how much of a difference in reg spring strength from brand to brand will really effect that issue? It would be interesting for someone out there t [ Continued ] View Rest Of Post
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Tbkahuna  00:38:09 Fri Apr 15 2011 Offline 1671 posts BBMG MASTER BLASTER +1000  Reply |
For more powerful airguns with high flow rates a better regulator will be necessary. Better meaning suited for the use with a larger orifice to keep the droop from being too high.
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camracer 00:26:41 Fri Apr 15 2011 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
You're welcome!
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SONYtec 22:08:05 Thu Apr 14 2011 Offline 3691 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 .gif) Reply |
Thanks for the videos Cam.
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drozdandconfused 16:23:04 Thu Apr 14 2011 Offline 759 posts BBMG General **** Reply |
I had a Super 80cf 3300 psi tank which failed hydro. It had spent a night rolling around in the surf after my dive "buddy" let a 2 foot wave dump it out of the dingy while coming to shore after a night dive. The valve was opened while rolling around and it filled with sea water. I had it tumbled and it passed hydro, but 5 years later, they did that bright light test and said they could see some hairline cracks. Uneventful, Yes. Bummer, totally because that extra 300 psi would be great for this HPA application (I could top my small tanks off at 3000 longer) as far as I know, you can't get the super 80's anymore (new).
As far as the reg droop, it is real. More so depending on the reg (Pure Energy) you use. I know I could demonstrate it with ballistics, and maybe I'll get around to it, but it is not top of the list. If you watch the first New PCB video I did, the scene where we are shooting into "Lake Commerce" both regs are set at 1200-1250. You can see and here the difference of the power of my gun. When TomC does those circles in the water, you can see and hear the lack of power. Both tanks were filled before that scene. Both guns have the same voltage and same basic POT adjustment. If I switch tanks, then the gun TomC was shooting is the one that shoots with power. TBK is right about the orifice on some regs. Small. Cam is right about the small gauges, they're crap. One of these daze I'll get one of those liquid gauges and test it out on the PE reg. I'm curious too. Cheerz | ||||
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camracer 10:21:27 Wed Apr 13 2011 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
I saw a photo of an aluminum tank at the scuba shop of a failed tank. A 7'' chunk was blown off the top along with the valve. Makes me cringe when I accidentally knock my scuba tank over on hard ground!
Here's some videos for hydro tests: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JJUt6s-fB0 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AB9QvkvQuvM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JhlYQ4O55HU&NR=1
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Tbkahuna 04:49:11 Wed Apr 13 2011 Offline 1671 posts BBMG MASTER BLASTER +1000 Reply |
???
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SONYtec 03:14:55 Wed Apr 13 2011 Offline 3691 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
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Tbkahuna 00:36:32 Wed Apr 13 2011 Offline 1671 posts BBMG MASTER BLASTER +1000 Reply |
Pretty uneventful. That's why they test with water.
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SONYtec 00:15:24 Wed Apr 13 2011 Offline 3691 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
Anyone have video of a tank failing a hydro test?
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camracer 23:57:43 Tue Apr 12 2011 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
Glad to help you. No problem! That's the fun of this forum to share info! And, yeah time to get a new tank. Probably will pass hydro, but in Connecticut where I'm from, It's too old to touch! Ray at DrozdMax will get back to you soon, I'm sure. He's got a new kid in the family. That takes a lot of attention! Give him a chance. He really helped me out a bunch when I was 'figgurin out my shim set-up! ......Believe me, you are about to open up a whole new world of fun, when you get into all the mods that we have all contributed to!!  ---Cam
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camracer 23:43:32 Tue Apr 12 2011 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
Ram, as much as anyone may think, I am No expert on everything! I haven't been here that long. I just like to talk too much!  Heh, heh. There are others who have way more experience with "shims" and "washers" for regs than me. I can help you shim your set-up to mine as I have mine set up, if you wish. Others like Drozdandconfused and Radical (sorry to who I missed!) know more than me about other reg types.Here's my set-up for shim/washer on the Ninja: ("small end" to "large" end, left to right: 1600 psi: 1 red washer, 3 silver. Washer config: )()()()()() 1400 psi: 1 red, 1 silver. Washer config: )()()()()(( Gotta experiment to see what else for pressure output. Try it out. ---Cam
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camracer 23:18:22 Tue Apr 12 2011 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
Correct it is, to a point! ...My output burst disk is rated for 1.8K. Check yours when you get it. I expect the same one. Don't go above it. ...It won't kill you. It'll just "burst the disk" and scare the pants off you if it goes! Replace it for higher pressure. I have to guess, ('cause i don't have it in front of me), but I'm pretty sure my 1600 psi tank has a 2.2k burst. The tank burst on mine is 7.5K rated (fill).(You will not replace that one ever.) ---Cam
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Ramatam 18:09:17 Tue Apr 12 2011 Offline 30 posts BBMG Corporal Reply |
Thanks for all the answers....
About my scuba tank: The manufacture date is from 1972....chances are it'll fail. If I have to pay for hydro and vip and it fails then I'm out about 40 bucks...best put the money into a newer tank. I got a lot of dives off the old one...and I got it used way back when so got my money's worth. Hope you can answer the other Q's re: output adjustment on the ninja. I had contacted Drozdmax about buying and having output set to 1250 but haven't heard back...so thought I'd give the local shop some support ....they were REALLY interested in seeing the Blackbird so I orderd the Ninja from them. Gotta go with the local guys from time to time you know? I know it's hard for them to compete against the online stores. I think they'll be OK with adjusting but since they deal with paintball pressures all the time thought I'd help by supplying as much info from you guys as possible. Thanks again....this is gonna be fun when I get it all together!! | ||||
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