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24 people online in the last 60 minutes - 0 members, 0 anon and 24 guests. (Most ever was 121 at 02:27:28 Wed Oct 19 2011) |
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freeman34 17:15:41 Wed Nov 28 2012 Offline 198 posts BBMG Brigadier General * Reply |
thanks for the explanation dubb, I always wondered why they shipped them out rifled.
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camracer  14:39:02 Mon Nov 26 2012 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000  Reply |
I definitely do DUBB! I still have a stash of maybe 20 lbs. I use it exclusively for rodent control in my 30 round clip mag. I really is great stuff.
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DUBB  12:52:54 Mon Nov 26 2012 Offline 2253 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000  Reply |
Cam knows the adventure I lead us on searching for new lead. We came into some nickel plated buckshot that fit good, and shot great, but you had to buy lots of it, as it only came in 11lb sacks (I have a couple stashed in the clothset), and it was less than consistant, so you have to make a strainer, and sift through it. That, and rolling them down a smooth plank to sort out the out of round ones helps. But I think that we were pretty unanimous on the accuracy verdict: it won, hands down. And I worked out all the math, it was a lot cheaper, too. It's really hard to get, Midway might have some, even if the distributor, BP, doesn't.
Nope, out of stock, and out of luck. I think we bought it all.
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camracer 23:36:14 Sun Nov 25 2012 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
I wonder if lead shot is the "be-all" in Russia???........
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DUBB 21:06:29 Sun Nov 25 2012 Offline 2253 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
Don't use those with the new barrels, though. They will jam, for sure. The Drozd was designed to use lead balls, not steel bb's, in fact, it even says not to use steel in the manual. Now this might confuse you, since the importer, EAA, insisted that they include a pack of steel bb's in the box with every new gun. But the Drozd is a pellet gun, for spherical pellets, it has a rifled barrel. All .177 barrels can shoot steel bb's, but not very well, since steel bb's are deliberately made a bit smaller than .177 pellets, so they wont ruin the rifling of a pelletgun barrel.
This is the whole point behind Drozdmax's new barrels: since everybody shoots steel, a non-rifled barrel that fits tighter, like "BB guns" (that only shoot steel bb's) would be better for steel bb's. Who knows what they were thinking when they designed it for lead balls, since there is really only that one brand, .177 lead is hard to come by. Believe me, I searched. Again, don't shoot lead with these new barrels.
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freeman34 17:15:46 Sat Nov 24 2012 Offline 198 posts BBMG Brigadier General * Reply |
That's pretty cool, should add a little extra FPE, thanks for the link.
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DUBB 06:54:08 Fri Nov 23 2012 Offline 2253 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
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freeman34 23:49:27 Tue Nov 20 2012 Offline 198 posts BBMG Brigadier General * Reply |
What's this talk about lead shot? Is there a brand name I can search for? I wanna try
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camracer 23:01:04 Mon Nov 19 2012 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
Ray, I'm not surprised!!
If you all want to shoot just bb's, Ray's (DrozdMax) barrels are the absolute best there are available for smooth bore! If you wanna shoot lead shot then go with the rifled barrels he offers! Ya know, It really comes down to EXACTLY how you are looking to shoot your Drozd! As for barrel choice, I personally use Ray's rifled barrel. ....Because, when you are "slinging" "THAT" much metal down range (1200-2000 RPM) You's gonna hit what you shoot at in a second or two...  ...You choose your shooting habits, and well help guide you to the best barrel for you! Right Ray??!
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totalh 16:43:29 Mon Nov 19 2012 Offline 349 posts BBMG Major General ** Reply |
I just wanted to drop a quick post about velocity of the smooth bores.
Last week a customer sent me his gun to install a JimC 23" barrel he bought from me. He wanted to use 1200 psi of HPA.... After doing the BB centering mod (different then how camracer does it), installing a latch plate, and aligning the mag head to the breech I shot the gun over a chrony and was getting an average of 830 fps. This is not bad but not great either considering using 1200 psi. I walked back into my shop and swapped out the rifled barrel for a smooth bore and re-tested over the chrony. Average velocity after 10 shots was 900 fps. In short I was not expecting such a big increase in velocity from rifled to smooth. Usually it is only around 30 fps, but hey I will take it. Also, I have been switching out a lot of the JimC barrels for smooth ones lately and I am definitely seeing a decent increase in accuracy. I have not done any hard testing but I do notice that there are a lot less wingers when shooting on semi-auto.
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radical  02:01:08 Sat Nov 17 2012 Offline 5155 posts BBMG LIFER  Reply |
Winter's one of my fave times to pull ice blocs out of the pool cover and make DrozdArt of them!
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camracer 00:05:18 Fri Nov 16 2012 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
Time to try shooting snowmen, Right Bry???!  .....I HATE winter!!---Cam
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freeman34 23:05:24 Thu Nov 15 2012 Offline 198 posts BBMG Brigadier General * Reply |
well that makes sense. I think I was thinking of shotguns when I typed that up, the spin flicks the bb's in every direction. | ||||||
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windage 07:49:00 Tue Nov 13 2012 Offline 313 posts BBMG Major General ** Reply |
Hi guys!
Sorry I haven't responded for awhile. My tests were like it was mentioned before, not too good for comparision. Now that we have 1 foot of snow, I don't think I will be retesting anytime soon. The air pressure was not labeled on my reg so I don't know. I am assuming it was a regular reg for paintball since it wasn't labeled. Fps was sort of an estimate by doing a penetration test on a phone book. I shot the phone book with the Jim C barrel and took note on the number of pages it penetrated and then did the same with the new smoothbore barrel of same length. The 3% was the difference in results between the two barrel types. I did shoot using my pickup as a rest so it was very steady and yes I shut the truck off while shooting  I have a feeling copperhead and RWS BB's will do better then the daisys but I will have to do another shooting test and try to make the comparison more accurate. BTW, I have been using a new ninja 33cu HPA tank and I must say that they seem to be the perfect size. They are not to heavy for direct mountng to the Blackbird mag and still provide enough shots while out in the field. | ||||
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totalh 03:54:25 Sat Nov 10 2012 Offline 349 posts BBMG Major General ** Reply |
The reason rifling negatively affects BBs is because BBs are too hard to use the rifling inside the barrel. Instead of slightly deforming like lead does, BBs (especially steel) stay rigid and sit on top of the lands. Due to the BB's being undersized to begin with the rifling will throw off the accuracy as the BB leaves the end of the barrel because the BBs are actually bumping, and swirling down the barrel instead of twisting down the barrel like they should. So depending on how the BB last touches the end of the barrel you can have BBs that fly up, down, left right. The smooth bore barrel only increases accuracy because there is no rifling to make the BB jump around as it is being pushed down the barrel. Also the tighter tolerances (.174 bore) help to keep the BB from moving around inside the barrel as it is being fired.
Spinning BBs DO fly straighter, that is why airsoft guns have "hop up". Hop up is essentially adding spin to the BB before it leaves the barrel so that they fly straighter. I believe it has to do with centrifugal force but I could be wrong. As for using copper BBs in the new smooth bores....you actually can if you want to (i have numerous times) but I recommend that you do not because the copper BBs are slightly bigger to begin with and they tend to have more defects and just worse quality control than do the daisy steel BBs.
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freeman34 22:18:10 Fri Nov 9 2012 Offline 198 posts BBMG Brigadier General * Reply |
Spinning bb's don't fly as straight as non-spinning bb's for some reason, I can't remember why. I think the spin destabilizes them. Has anyone had any luck shooting copperheads through their new barrels? I know we've been told they would jam, i'm just wondering if this is the case with newer barrels, and batches of bb's. | ||||||
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radical 03:49:35 Fri Nov 2 2012 Offline 5155 posts BBMG LIFER Reply |
I dont see why a smooth bore would have accuracy improvemen, maybe though in other areas?
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camracer 10:27:20 Wed Oct 24 2012 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
...and also same batteries and pressure.
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totalh 15:30:25 Tue Oct 23 2012 Offline 349 posts BBMG Major General ** Reply |
Windage,
I am glad you have had a chance to finally test the smooth bore barrel and post some pictures. I have to say from your testing it makes the JimC barrels appear to be more accurate. The first question that comes to my mind is are you holding the gun or are you mounting it in a rest of some kind? Also, as you already know you are not really comparing apples to apples since you used a scope on the first target and different ammo. If it is not too much to ask can you use the same aiming device and ammo then try your testing again with both the JimC and the new smooth bore? My next question I have is, how much in FPS is a 3% gain?
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camracer 00:45:00 Tue Oct 23 2012 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
What pressure were you shooting with windage? ---Cam
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windage 00:20:05 Tue Oct 23 2012 Offline 313 posts BBMG Major General ** Reply |
I was hoping you guys wouldn't notice that.
But ya that target was shot with Daisy BBs only. | ||||
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camracer 00:06:20 Tue Oct 23 2012 Offline 4933 posts BBMG LIFE BLASTER +2000 Reply |
Heh!, ...ya know, they DO!! I missed that. The "Gamo" target looks just like rimfire .22!........???? Interesting. ---Cam
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radical 18:50:48 Mon Oct 22 2012 Offline 5155 posts BBMG LIFER Reply |
Hey windage, the first 23" smooth bore @ 45' look lead pellet or 22 rim fire. Curious how the holes look.
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windage 02:26:55 Sat Oct 20 2012 Offline 313 posts BBMG Major General ** Reply |
Finally got some shooting in today with the new smoothbore barrels. I only tried shooting with the daisy BBs and my aiming apparatus was a Red dot with no magnifier. The barrel used was a 23" barrel. The group size is shown below.
 10 single shot group for 2 3/4" inch size at 45 feet or 15 yards. I shot this group 2 years ago with a JimC barrel.  I am not sure of how many shots are in that group but for sure over 10 single shots. The group size was 2 inches at the same distance. At first glance you are probably thinking that the JimC barrel is more accurate but before you come to a final conclusion I must state the differences. When I shot the group with the JimC barrel I was using Marksman BBs and a 3x9 scope. I believe the scope and the type of BBs would make a difference. To make a fair comparision, I should shoot the same kind of BBs and use a 3x9 scope. Am I gaining any accuracy by using the new barrels? No, I don't believe so but I am not losing any either. I was kind of hoping to achieve a fair amount of gain in accuracy over the JimC barrels but it doesn't look like it. I did gain some velocity but not as much as I had hoped. On average I gained around 3%. On a good note, the barrel that I tested functioned perfectly and I didn't suffer from any jams or problems while I shot through 400 rounds or so. I also should mention that these barrels need a good scubbing on the inside. I don't have a 177 bore barrel brush yet. I did however clean it with patches and bore solvent to achieve a decent cleaning job. | ||||
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radical 06:16:56 Wed Oct 10 2012 Offline 5155 posts BBMG LIFER Reply |
Looking forward to seeing the results! pics!...pics!...
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freeman34 23:22:59 Fri Oct 5 2012 Offline 198 posts BBMG Brigadier General * Reply |
Mine just arrived, looks good. I placed two recent orders from your site, and USPS shipped it faster (to canada) than those jackasses at UPS, and I didn't have to shell out $30 for a brokerage fee, so i'm pleased. Mucho gracias!
I'm waiting for my magnets to arrive before I test out the barrel, but i'll report back here after I finally get a chance to bench it. | ||||
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totalh 15:59:05 Fri Oct 5 2012 Offline 349 posts BBMG Major General ** Reply |
I am glad you received your barrel in good order. I look forward to hearing your results.
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windage 06:06:29 Fri Oct 5 2012 Offline 313 posts BBMG Major General ** Reply |
I got mine in mail. Thanks Ray.
At first inspection, I was impressed with the blueing on the barrels. The barrel finish is very nice. The caliber of the barrel seems to be very close in diameter to JimC's barrels but hey, 0.03 of an inch is a very small difference. The daisy BBs I rolled through them seem to roll nicely and the air does slow their decent. I am hoping to do an accuracy test tomorrow but work seems to be getting in the way. Unfortunately I haven't fired a shot yet since I live in the city. I will have a review ready sometime in the near future, I hope. | ||||
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totalh 16:51:06 Thu Oct 4 2012 Offline 349 posts BBMG Major General ** Reply |
Has anybody actually started to use their smooth bore barrel yet?
Im looking for feedback if you have.
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Kinetic_Genius 18:33:23 Sat Sep 22 2012 Offline 276 posts BBMG Major General ** Reply |
I went and ordered the remaining parts I needed from Jim C., they should be here in about a week or two.. I ain't taking chances on the accuracy so just wait for the parts to get here. Anyway I will need to do the centering mod or magnet mod, I am starting to notice bbs are rolling out of the barrel so check your email soon about that! | ||||||||
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