New 49er     

:: :: Trying to muzzle Dave again!
Lost Password :: Posting Pictures :: Who's Online :: Stats :: Memberlist :: Top Posters :: Search

Make a donation to our message forums through Paypal

Make a donation to our Legal Fund.



Welcome, Register :: Log In Welcome to our newest member, hubberjonas.

people online in the last 1 minutes - 0 members, 0 anon and 0 guests. (Most ever was 34 at 15:22:43 Fri Sep 10 2021)

Pages: [ 1 ]

[ Notify ][ Print ][ Send To Friend ] [ Watch ] [ < ] [ > ]

531 posts
Trying to muzzle Dave again! ( 00:01:02 SunApr 21 2013 )

What is up with PLP?

Here is Jerry Hobbs talking to the public at a recent GPAA show:
This YouTube presentation has Jerry expressing two themes for his fund-raising efforts; both which I feel are off base:

1) First, he publicly bashes Dave McCracken for releasing news about this new method of prospecting which will allow California miners the opportunity to prospect underwater again. Here is the new method:

Jerry claims that there is already a whole new law-suit over this issue. That is not true! Jerry certainly knows the difference; but perhaps he is confusing a "law-suit" with a Petition recently filed with California Fish & Wildlife by anti-mining activists to eliminate the new method of mining in California. Friday, the California authorities overruled that Petition. Here is the link:

This sets the stage for the most productive mining season we will have seen in California for the past three years. This is largely because Dave McCracken informed the industry that the opportunity is available to us.

While we surely will face more challenges ahead, Jerry advocates a strategy in his presentation that Dave should not keep members of the New 49ers and others within the industry who read our forum informed of industry developments for fear of upsetting our enemies, all while Jerry attempts to overcome our problems with more years of litigation. Really? If Dave cannot inform members of new mining opportunities as they become available because of Jerry's and other miner's fears of our enemies, haven't we already lost? This is a 1st amendment rights issue. Are you really telling Dave not to exercise his 1st amendment rights in America because you fear the environmentalists will file another lawsuit?

You know; it all starts with mining. If we are not going to do it when we can, what the heck are we fighting for?

2) Jerry is also not telling the whole truth about the need for PLP to pay $100,000 for an administrative record to keep the ongoing litigation going in San Bernardino. The State of California has agreed to provide this record! Jerry fails to mention that there is a written stipulation limiting PLP's liability for the cost of that record.

What about just telling the truth?

This is the second vocal attack on Dave McCracken and/or The New 49'ers during recent weeks.

The WMA is not giving the New 49ers credit for their extensive legal efforts and support that our club has provided, and have taken personal credit for the efforts of the New 49'ers' attorney, and even for the New 49ers involvement in the original Alameda court Karuk vs CDF&G suit. You cannot have it both ways!

PLP and WMA should get back to defending the industry the honest way. Bashing other industry leaders and mining associations in public who are actively promoting small-scale mining is not good leadership! The purpose of The New 49'ers has always been to open up mining opportunities for their members. They have been doing that admirably for almost 30 years. There are always going to be a few people around who have nothing better to do but sit back and criticize others who are at least trying.

I am surprised to see PLP taking this up as it's primary fund-raising drive on YouTube! Where is the leadership?

I would hope Jerry would have the common sense to remove the above video from YouTube. One industry leader attacking another industry leader in public does not help the small miner cause in any way! I am tired of having to publicly defend my very close friend Dave McCracken from others whom feel it is OK to attack him in public, especially from people whom should know better.

The people at PLP and WMA should know that if we don't all stick together, we are all definitely going to hang separately!

It is time for the leaders of this industry to put their petty issues aside and stand strong together as one industry, or at the very least let it publicly appear so!


[4 edits; Last edit by UncleMark at 05:15:41 Mon Apr 22 2013]

1928 posts

Re: Trying to muzzle Dave again! ( 00:07:22 SunApr 21 2013 )

Quote: UncleMark at 00:01:02 Sun Apr 21 2013 It is time for the leaders of this industry to put their petty issues aside and stand strong together as one industry, or at the very least let it publicly appear so![br


Well said Mark, and it needed to be said and out in the open.

James Foley
Property and Mining Rights Advocate
Horse Creek, California
Re: Trying to muzzle Dave again! ( 00:19:37 SunApr 21 2013 )

I have to agree 2000 percent with Mark... Dave is the Captain of the Ship if you ask me and Thank You again for all your efforts in every way.
John B

315 posts
Me &amp; Tank Klamath 200
Re: Trying to muzzle Dave again! ( 01:29:55 SunApr 21 2013 )


The seeds of contention have been planted by our enemies and all the divisive talk is just plain FERTILIZER!

I will not cower in the shadows in fear of what the enviro-fascists will say or do...



85 posts
Re: Trying to muzzle Dave again! ( 01:39:02 SunApr 21 2013 )

at least a apology is in order. this whole in water prospecting thing has gotten to all of us who really care. tempers fly ,blood boils. bottom line is one for all and all for one. united we stand. thanx for the point mark.

145 posts

Re: Trying to muzzle Dave again! ( 02:48:53 SunApr 21 2013 )

Thanks a lot for sticking up for me, you guys!

There are two sides to this debate which Jerry and I have gone back and forth on from the beginning. As good as his intentions are, Jerry has never run a successful business. He makes his money from providing legal defense services for the industry. That is the only side of the equation he knows. Jerry forgets that there has to be an industry in the first place. By industry, I mean it all has to start with mining. Not just the idea of mining.

Even our enemies know that the industry will eventually fade away if they can prevent us from mining. Australia is a good case in point. They had a flourishing suction dredge industry until anti-mining activists succeeded in getting the government to shut it down. Now there are only a few guys around who remember how good “it used to be.” There is no remaining legal defense for suction dredgers in Australia because the activity has been shut down for so long.

The other side is that generating mining activity increases the risks that anti-mining activists will oppose it. Jerry is expressing concerns that we will have to raise even more resources for defense because a bunch of us are going to be out on the river again. I’m sure he is right. We will just have to do it!

I am personally certain the answer is not to stop generating mining activity. We have already lost if we go along with that notion. The industry cannot survive on legal activity alone. We have to mine!

Mark is correct in that Jerry is over-stating PLP’s liability to produce the Administrative Record. The cap on the Miner’s part of this is $7,500. New 49’ers will pay half. We are going to make that happen.

This does not mean that Jerry is mis-stating the financial burden, though. Carrying the weight of six ongoing cases is a lot to shoulder. I think that is the real message he is trying to put out.

Fortunately The New 49’ers are carrying at least half the burden through our own legal defense fund.

Raising money is the most difficult part of legal defense. It is especially painful when there is not enough money to keep up. The truth is that Jerry just looks tired.

376 posts
Re: Trying to muzzle Dave again! ( 14:45:59 SunApr 21 2013 )

Dave, I had been hoping to see your comments before I added my 2 cents worth. Now I have almost nothing to say except, Jerry looks tired and is showing the effects of non-ending battle.

Why he defamed you and the people who are New 49ers is confusing at the least. I feel a GPAA presence in his video. Now that pisses me off.

GPAA it's time for you to follow the leader, Dave Mack along with his handpicked 49rs, are on a roll. Get the LL out of the mouth games and help us miners be miners. You can sit on your butts and watch us get back on the Klamath River or you can be some sort of a problem. Miners are everthing here.


Uncle Mark, thanks again.

Your writings in support of your lifestyle as lived beside your irreplacable partner, Dave, is warmly received.

I propose we establish a miners festival on the Klamath this season. GPAA can sell admission tickets to it's members who wish to witness miners being miners. I'm sure they would learn a few things.

[1 edits; Last edit by Rod_Seiad at 14:57:44 Sun Apr 21 2013]

Re: Trying to muzzle Dave again! ( 15:42:30 TueApr 23 2013 )

The support, defense, and trust from a mans friends, speaks volumes of his character.

Dave has been and is at the forefront of the fight, taking on our enemy's head on. The last thing he needs or deserves, Is flak from behind.

I agree Jerry shouldn't have pointed his finger at Dave. The Center listed the forum as well as the New49'ers web site.

And PLP probably lost more support from this comment than thay gained.

Is that stack of PLP cards still on the counter at the New49'ers office?

53 posts
Re: Trying to muzzle Dave again! ( 16:54:03 TueApr 23 2013 )

Good post Mark...

Not a time for divisiveness thats for sure...I defend Dave and the New 49ers weekly on a certain Gold Dredge forum that a couple guys just poisen and poison was a close friend of Daves at one time. He's just a negative, seemingly drunk dude. The funny thing is, people fall for his deceit...

Disappointed in Jerry...I think he is just frustrated at the whole thing. But, why stay out of the river and not do the new method if we can? It has been OK'd by CFW...that is what the enemy wants.

Maybe Jerry should build himself a sub-surface gravel mover and go at it!


Re: Trying to muzzle Dave again! ( 15:43:44 WedApr 24 2013 )

Hope to see yah at Independence Creek Alan fir 7 4/2013festval!:doublethumbsup:


Pages: [ 1 ]

[ Notify ][ Print ][ Send To Friend ] [ Watch ] [ < ] [ > ]

 Total Members: 4903

  • Can't start a new thread. (Admins Only)
  • Can't start a new poll. (Admins Only)
  • Can't add a reply. (Admins Only)
  • Can't edit your posts.(Everyone Registered)
  • Register :: Log In :: Administrators

    The time is 11:33:08 Fri Aug 12 2022

    Powered By BbBoard V1.4.2
    © 2001-2007
    [Most Recent Quotes from]

    [Most Recent Quotes from]