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blackjeep
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5" triple question. ( 16:56:00 SatApr 9 2011 )

Like most beginning dredgers, the 3" I bought from Rusty was too slow. I picked up an old 5" Keene triple with a crash box. It has a new Honda 9 horse, no numbers on the pump. Any tips on alterations for the fine gold on the Rogue? Everthing except the motor seems to be original. Thanks in advance, Jim.

  
Rod_Seiad
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 17:34:53 SatApr 9 2011 )

I recommend you take your 5" down to your local boat launch and assemble then run it for a tank of fuel. You'll be surprised how many fixes you discover. Put some money into upgrading and replacing the old stuff.

Once you get to running your second tank of gas you should begin to tune the recovery system. Don't process material, just pump clear water. You can devote hours and hours studying the pros and cons of the many adjustments.

Several guys prefer the old crashboxes over the flares. I always disliked the bubbles and knew gold was floating on thru.

  
RUSTY_HAPPY_CAM
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 00:52:15 SunApr 10 2011 )

A couple important fixes come to mind. The old style triple set completely on top of the old banana pontoons. Due to a serious lack of flotation these top heavy dredges wobbled badly in current and often turned over. If you are tight on money and your existing pontoons are sound you can add a set of 2 outrigger pontoons and that will keep you up right. However the best thing to do is build a completely new frame similar to the new style Keene units that place the sluice box in between 6 of Keene's newer model pontoons. This solves a lot of problems. By lowering the complete unit you increase the performance of you pump/motor, increase stability and gives you new sound pontoons instead of the old brittle ones that are waiting to crack. The second area of interest is the side boxes. Keene put way too large of riffles in them for good fine gold recovery and they hold a lot of crap. This forum and 49ermikes.com have long discussions on improvements to the side boxes.

  
markB
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 03:38:18 SunApr 10 2011 )

Take the side boxes off.

  
LipCa
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 14:42:08 SunApr 10 2011 )

Those side boxes are the best for fine gold recovery.

When I had my triple, never had much in center box, almost all in side boxes.

  
beammaker
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 16:53:38 SunApr 10 2011 )

Heck yes Lip Cal:

I can always plan on sucking some pure gold fines from around the little flow adjusting wings at the top of each side box on my Keene triple. It keeps you excited to keep on going down-under every day.

Yes it seems that most of the yellow volume comes from the side boxes, and the stepdown from the punch plate in the center box always holds some pleasant suprises also.

In personally viewing Colo Nuggets new Keene rubber riffles, I would suggest adding this (or the new LeTrap riffles)and the 1/8" screening to an extra new lead box section---then bolt on the original section to follow. Side boxes also. May need to increase the water flow.
Just my idea on this subject after my Colo Nuggets visit.

For the above modifications, you will definitely need extra flotation. Kudos to Ratled for me solving this problem on my dredge.

Watch out for this Colorado man----he is seriously going to take the Rogue river for a productive ride this summer!!!!

Beammaker

  
blackjeep
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 05:17:27 MonApr 11 2011 )

Thank you all for the advice. This "old dog" is still learning new tricks. I'm pushing 60 and have as much prospecting enthusiasm as a 14 year old on his first date. Thanks again, Jim

  
UncleMark
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 14:03:05 MonApr 11 2011 )

I ran a keene triple five back in 88 for an entire season.

Loved the recovery, but it was hard to pack in and out.

Do not take off the side boxes as the center box is way to short to be your only recovery box, especially in fine gold.

I would 100% agree with Rusty about checking the floats for brittleness. If they are the old banana floats instead of the square ones you will need additional flotation.

To make it a serious fine gold machine, I would make a longer frame with another set of floats and add a flare tube and trash the crash box.

Other than that, a heavier damper to force more water into the side boxes, and miners moss in the center box to help catch more of the fine gold that does not make it into the side boxes.

I used mine in a flood gold deposit that that was all very fine gold with lots of black sand and was very happy with the recovery. I was catching finer gold than someone running across river from me with a keene single sluice five.

Mark

  
aunuts
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 21:38:42 MonApr 11 2011 )

I purchased Ray Koons 5" triple with 8 floats and a Honda 9hp. You cannot get me to trade this rig for any other 5". She is stable in fast water and the fines show up in the side boxes. This is a plus feature as I do not have to have a clean-up to see if I am in to gold, just look in the box. Also I can have a person on the dredge to fuel or clean out plug ups. If I go to Oregon I can put a ring in it to make a 4". This rig has produced pounds of gold for Ray and ounces for me.

  
UncleMark
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 03:51:32 TueApr 12 2011 )

aunuts

The factory five inch nozzle should measure 4 1/4 " inside diameter. If it does, it falls within the tolerance with ODEQ for a four inch intake ring.

Mark

  
Rod_Seiad
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 16:13:23 TueApr 12 2011 )

He He He, excellent point Uncle.

A souped-up hot-rodded 5" with a 4 1/4" restrictor will be the real deal from now on.

I think we're going to replace some old tired dredges with up to date equipment and put money into technologies that are long overdue.

Progress.

  
riverwatcher
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input on pumps ( 16:05:17 SatApr 30 2011 )

I am starting to look over pumps to gear up for highbanker
this pump looks promising but I need the expert advice of thos who know best..http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200395732_200395732
any input would be appreciated.
thanks Ya'll
CJ

  
LipCa
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Re: input on pumps ( 16:22:27 SatApr 30 2011 )

riverwatcher, you might want to put your question in its own thread.....not in the thread on a 5" triple.

might get more lookers.

ps and put in a link that works...:fishwhack:

  
riverwatcher
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Re: input on pumps ( 18:09:57 SatApr 30 2011 )

LipCa,
thanks as you can tell I am Not very good at this .
will try and figure it out . sorry for not going by the protocal.

  
LipCa
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Re: input on pumps ( 01:30:19 SunMay 1 2011 )

just thought you might get more advice with its own thread.

we all post links that don't work once in a while. I always try to open mine after I post them.(If I remember)

  
markB
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Re: input on pumps ( 05:22:43 SunMay 1 2011 )

Getting back on track here about those keene triples...has anybody done a test by blocking off the side boxes to see how much the center box loses? I see a comment that gold is caught right at the beginning of the side boxes. I guess what I'm concerned with is that classifing the smaller material to the side boxes you are bound to get finer gold in those boxes but what would, in this set-up, make one believe the center box wouldn't catch those fines?

  
rlh1946
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 15:16:32 SunMay 1 2011 )

Quote: UncleMark at 03:51:32 Tue Apr 12 2011

aunuts

The factory five inch nozzle should measure 4 1/4 " inside diameter. If it does, it falls within the tolerance with ODEQ for a four inch intake ring.

Mark

<>
are you saying ...if I reduce my 6" nozzle down to a max of 4.25" ODEQ will let it pass as a 4"????
where is that stated in the ODEQ rules so I can make a copy to carry on my dredge....Thanks for the info.



---
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markB
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 19:09:44 SunMay 1 2011 )

Oregon goes by the intake nozzle size and horsepower. Go to the link below for the 700-PM permit.


"DEQ references supplemental documents for conditions to protect water quality and beneficial uses in the NPDES 700-PM permit. Persons assigned to the NPDES 700-PM permit must not operate a suction dredge more than 16 horsepower or with an inside diameter intake nozzle greater than four inches in essential salmon habitat (ESH)."
http://www.deq.state.or.us/wq/wqpermit/mining.htm#GeneralNPDES

  
rlh1946
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 20:54:41 SunMay 1 2011 )

So the 4.25" being ok is false?



---
proud father of a Army Soldier
"PLP" member
"NRA" member
"UFC" fan
Why don't anti-gun people have stickers on their windows that say "This is a gun free home"
 
 
markB
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 21:37:45 SunMay 1 2011 )

I recall reading something like that (4.25 inches)on an Oregon site. I don't think that it was "printed in blood", just local observation. It may well depend on the individual enforcement officer's opionion. May well be more of an issue in high traffic dredging areas with more law enforcement available to police rules (Rogue??). I'll keep looking 'cause I remember reading somewhere about "4 inch nozzle with no more than 1" space to inside dia. hose". However it was worded, 4" nozzle opening....6" inside dia hose.
I'd look at it similar to driving 69 miles an hour in a 65 limit....depends on the cop.

  
UncleMark
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Re: 5" tripple question. ( 05:31:21 TueMay 3 2011 )

I miss quoted the ODEQ website in my above post, here is a clarification.

4 1/8" is within the wear tolerance allowed by ODEQ. This is posted on the ODEQ website as an answer to questions to the original proposal of the new 700 pm permit.

The question asked was " My factory 5" has an intake ring inside diameter of 4 1/8 ". Will this intake be legal under your proposed regulations?"

The answer given by ODEQ on their own website was

THAT INTAKE WOULD BE ALLOWED BY OUR TOLERANCES

This issue is not to be debated here on the forums, ODEQ has already stated that a 4 1/8 inch intake is a legal intake.

http://www.deq.state.or.us/wq/wqpermit/docs/general/npdes700pm/RTCf.pdf

Page 9, third item.

I personally wrote to Beth Moore at ODEQ about this issue and the answer given to my question of,

"What exactly is the largest wear tolerance that would be allowed by ODEQ, 4 1/4" or 4 3/8", because there would have to be a wear tolerance allowed for that factory 4 1/8" nozzle you have allowed on your website?"

the replied quote was " we do not have an absolute maximum and do not wish to create one. There will be an acceptable wear tolerance allowance."

So, the answer to this question is simple, if you try to make an intake that is above 4 1/4 inches in diameter, you will be pushing the limits that ODEQ has stated on it's own website that they would allow.

However, ODEQ has stated on it's own website that a factory 5" nozzle would be acceptable by their wear tolerances.

So if you are using a factory 5" nozzle, there is no reason to expect ODEQ to have any issues with your nozzle.

The issue here is that ODEQ does not use the size of a suction hose to define the size of a suction dredge, as does Keene or some other dredge manufactures. They use the size of the intake ring on the suction nozzle. This is a much better way to define the size of a dredge because it allows you to use an oversize suction hose to reduce the amounts of plug ups you get, without having any effect on the size of cobbles you can suck up.

So rather than argue about whether or not you can use a 4 1/4 inch intake ring, the question should be are you using a factory 5 inch nozzle which would be allowed by ODEQ or are you custom making your own nozzle and trying to stretch it to the largest size possible??????????

ODEQ has stated that they do not wish to get in a pssing match on this subject, so lets not do it here.

Mark
[1 edits; Last edit by UncleMark at 05:36:49 Tue May 3 2011]

  
klondike_jake
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Re: 5" triple question. ( 03:22:59 MonMay 30 2011 )

i would like to alaborate on a couple things here.i have the same 5in triple.traded the triple box for a brand new crash single box.its 18in wide.i made modifications for good fine gold recovery.rased the crash box up 1in.added a quick check recovery area under the 3/8 punch plate.exstended the punch plate down over 4 riffles.and added a 24in long fan under 1/8 punch plate at the end of the sluce box.RRRR.only did 8hrs in trials it worked better than exspected.i have the factory nozel.4and 1/4 I.D. also have a 4in aluminum conduit coupler for a nozzel.it messures 41/2 I.D.im going to be taking up space on the rouge too.see ya thier RRRR.

  

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