Volks-Swap :: The Subaru Conversion

02:04:12 Sun
May 27 2012
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jdm ??

Just wondering how many here have used JDM engines in there swap?

How have they been?
Any problems?
Did they come damaged?

I am just wondering since they seem to be the best option, since the only donor cars i find around here have 200k+ and are selling for more then a JDM motor with 35k to 60k on them. I will be using a Stinger ECU and wiring harness from outfront motorsports.
Just wondering what u may have encountered with a JDM motor?

Thanks

EG33

15:52:22 Wed
May 30 2012
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Dreamer

Re: jdm ??

Hey! MadNESS!

I can answer that

YES, YES and YES

I took the JDM bait (I just gave away the ending?) and bought into the dream that these JDM were "low mileage" (good running?) motors that came over from Japan due to their strick clean-air regulations.

The 1st motor I bought looked (on the outside) to be exactly that, the perfect used engine. Surly some Geisha had the car since new. Then at around 40k mi, was forced by the government to give it up (along with any new born baby girls)

"It looked great"!...
I thought, until the day I filled it with oil and cranked it over to run a leak-down test.. I got good numbers from all cylinders (yea!) but I also got a oil "leak" the size of the Colorado river running down the front side of the cam cover (boo!). And that's just with cold cranking it.

I removed the front covers and spotted the problem, a BIG crack in the aluminum cover just in front of the cams. It was now obvious. The car and been "hit in the front", and something impacted the engine hard. I was crushed (no pun intended). Apparently that Geisha must have spent some serious Yen on oil?

I had to assume that the "hit" also contacted the nose of the cam and from there? Well, that whole cam area is held under very high tolerances. so everything on that side of the engine was now in question. I decided to relegate this engine as a "parts motor" and locate another one. Except for the wasted $$. It's nice to have a whole other engine to experiment on :smile:

Engine #2.
It was beautiful! (you think I would have learned). The "gear head gods" have smiled upon me! It really did look like it was just rebuilt in the past few years. Well, wouldn't you know it.. upon closer inspection, I spotted another crack in the front cover, but luckily it was only in the "plastic" cover. And there were no sensitive components behind it. Once I removed the intake manifold, I found broken glass on top of the motor. Not to mention that the top of the block looked far more used than the overall condition of the engine.. I guess the hi-pressure wash and clear coat didn't reach that far!). This pretty much confirmed that it too, was in a [front end] accident. Sweet!

Even before buying into these engines, I always use to wonder how many may have been smacked upside the head in accidents. I can only imagine the damage that must come from a engine rotating at speed and then is abruptly stopped cold in its tracks during a impact. And how many of them have no visible signs of the impact afterwards? Or the less than obvious signs, how the last driver(s) used or abused the engines?

Maybe at one time "JDM" meant that the motor did have limited miles. And were checked out and possibly even test run.. But lately that name: [JDM] has been used a little too fast and loose in my opinion. Possibly to drive more sales?.. But nobody would do that, right?...To separate you from your money. That's just crazy. Wrecking yards are the pillars of honesty and integrity! Aren't' they? :o\

If I ever need another used engine.. well, I don't know what I would do. Possibly just put on my Vegas gambling face and "roll the dice".. Because that's what it felt like. And hope I get one of the good ones? As I mentioned, the ultimate situation would be to buy [edit 5/31] - if you don't have the dough to go to a reputable engine provider/builder [end edit] a "running" complete car..

I don't know what the guys do who want to use automotive engines for experimental aircraft? egads...I think in that case, you would have to buy a good running (you got to drive it), complete car with no history of accidents.. Otherwise it's a roll of the dice, unfortunately.
In the air.. those are some BIG DICE.

I don't know if that answered anything.. but I feel better :o]

UN-CONVENTIONAL CONVERSIONS
"We sacrifice quality so that you can save.."
[5 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 14:55:21 Thu May 31 2012]

madness726

23:10:01 Wed
May 30 2012
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Re: jdm ??

Wow that sucks to hear.. I was thinking of buying a JDM from Outfront motorsports which from what I hear has good feed back. they only deal with Subaru motors for sandrails and swaps. and they have been around a bit. I just talked to my buddy down in SoCal and he said his motor in his rail is from them.. But it is a rebuild Jdm core with 400hp. So I am still up in the air. I would never purchase a motor from one of the JDM suppliers, not only do they seem shady but there warranty would be void for me. And Outfront knows that i am going to put it in a VW. But still a donor seems to be the best way, If I can ever find one with less then 200k and around $1200. I might look into the salvage auctions to find one that only has rear end damage, But you have to be a dealer to go to one of those auctions. So I need to find a friend that knows someone that has a dealers license. Also I dont need the ECU and wiring harness cause i am going to run a Stinger ecu and harness that is already made for the swap.

EG33

14:46:21 Thu
May 31 2012
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36 posts
Dreamer

Re: jdm ??

That was a sane post maDness

Good call!

I should have made a better distinction... I can only speak for the JDM engine-whore houses that I hooked up with. I actually drive by Outfront a couple of times a week! They are only about 20mins away. I have yet to stop in.. I'm not sure what their policy is on "dreamers" :oO But if my experiences arn't a good commercial for a reason to go to a "real shop", I don't know what is.

Outfront is a world apart from my cry for attention. Both my engines came from unknown sources, through the mail. Caveat emptor / buyer beware / you get what you pay for.. blaw blaw blaw...

I have no doubt that Outfront is as interested in having their customers satisfied than just about anybody, including their customers. They live and breathe Subees. That trumps anything we can test drive and install.. Utilizing them or another big reputable shop is taking the high road.. I actually was slumming it.

re: project
Inspire a future gear head!.. Post photos when you can..I don't know if I miss older posts.. but what's this engine going in? TEASE! Just can't get enough of dat' "conversion visual stimuli" (CVS).

Cheers!
R
[3 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 20:21:30 Thu May 31 2012]

madness726

21:02:56 Thu
May 31 2012
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Re: jdm ??

I have not bought the car yet. I am going to next month.
It is a 73' 1303. I want to put a EJ20t in it but i dont know if i want to go thru everything it takes to go turbo. Plus I think that a EJ22 will have enough power for me. I will be posting a full build when i get started. I am going to do a body off restore and go with the German look. I will start posting once i start. I will probably put 10K to 14K into the beetle by the time i am done. but maybe more :smile:
Cannot wait till it starts!!!!!!! [1 edits; Last edit by madness726 at 02:20:41 Sat Jun 2 2012]

EG33

18:45:26 Sat
Jun 2 2012
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36 posts
Dreamer

Re: jdm ??

Ej20T
"One of the best VW engine-swap choices, bar none"

First and foremost.. IT FITS! What a concept.

And the front of the 1303 (utilizing struts) lends itself to a front mounted radiator. Far easier than having to deal with a VW beam front end. It's like working around the great wall of China!

I did a water cooled conversion in a 79 sedan years ago.. and cut out the spare tire area, laid the radiator near flat and utilized the OEM louvers in the front skirt to feed it air.. I did ultimately need to put a small air dam (more like a small lip along the bottom to help direct the air.. but it was almost invisible, painted black). It was a quick fix.. I know another one of my big oversights was allowing the fuel tank to be exposed the radiator's hot exhaust air... this use to pre-heat my gas. Not a great performance tip. It could have been easily fixed but I just never got around to it. Speaking of that, I also didn't use a "fresh air" box for the side draft Delardo.. On warm days, those things took the edge of the engine's performance.

The 1303 (aka Super Beetle) really made for a more comfortable, smooth and quite car to drive... Luxury compared to the old school bugs. I even fell in love with that big windshield.. the dash really made the car feel roomy and quite modern. Unlike old school bugs where my knuckles would rub across the dash when making a turn.. now that's tight.

Performance wise.. That's a LOT. Not only would your 1303 be at least 500Lbs lighter than, say a STI (which I believe is about 2700). But the parasitic power loss will be much less. I understand that all-wheel-drive can consume as much as 20% of the engines power just to drive it (you don't get something for nothing). That could be power that now goes to your rear wheels..

As we know, it doesn't take much in a lightweight bug.. Like feeling the performance difference between a full tank of gas and a near empty one. Or the impact of a "passenger" or two :oO Over the years I've developed the "two fingered dyno" (no, it's not used on girls!).. Park any car on a smooth flat surface then just give it a tug to pull it forward or backward a foot or so. If it rolls with little effort, like just about any bug I've owned (with the proper tire pressure), then most of that engine's power will go to accelerating it instead of trying to overcome all the parasitic draw. If you try this with a Subaru sedan or any other car, the difference will be obvious. Tires, drive train, weight... It all adds up.. I'm always astounded that "two fingers" and a slight pull will get a bug rolling with little effort. Obviously why they can scoot pretty well even with only 36-53hp? Now don't tell anyone.. I would hate this to get out. 8o]

With my last conversion, I sure would have loved to have an extra gear or two.. Especially since it was a rotary (poor low end torque) There is only so much you can do with 4 forward gears. It's always a compromise. Wanting to launch hard and yet cruse down the highway at high speed and at a low RPM's ---- however, It would be a blast to drive no matter!

This is a MUST DO PROJECT. You don't want to go through life driving a Toyota Corolla Tercel?

Cheers!
Randy/USA
[6 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 16:08:19 Sun Jun 3 2012]

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