Thinking about a heart transplant for your air-cooled Volkswagen? You are in the right place! Post any questions/suggestions/stories you might have, or pictures of your conversion. This site is designed to help anyone thinking about doing a custom engine conversion in the back of your old-school V-dub.

Thanks for Visiting! I started this site to share the experiences I had when converting my 65 Bug to Mazda Rotary Power. Click here to visit my site for more information.
Volks-Swap :: Conversion Pictures :: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6



Welcome, Register :: Log In Our newest member is 1Kawboy.

Pages: [ 1 2 ]

[ Notify ][ Print ][ Send To Friend ] [ Watch ] [ < ]

EG33
05:56:34 Thu
Nov 22 2007

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6

First attempt @ posting photos


Current project. 67' Type I + Subee EG33

1967 VW Bug
Subaru (SVX) EG33 3.3L 6Cyl 230HP@5500 (non-turbo)
Quad Cam - 24V (non-interference)
EFI Multiport Injection
Direct Fire (no distributor)
Forged & Counterweighted crank (factory!)
All Aluminum, Heimspherical Heads, 7 Mains
Haltech E11v2 PEFI computer (still in box)
228MM (9") Stage II (lightened) flywheel & clutch
78 091 BUS transaxle (stock - due to lack of funding)
Custom dimensioned control-arms (anybody know why?)
GM style (rear) floating bearings, Wide-5 w/micro stubs
930 Lightened and relieved CV's
4 Piston Vented Disks (rear only due to micro stubs requirements)
Kennedy adaptor & Berg Bus "Quite" mounts.











*** BTW: This 67' body had serious RUST issues on the A pillars and along the base of the front windshield that was beyond reasonable repair. I was getting ready to sawZall the good sheetmental and part it out.. But I got the idea that I could gain some conversion knowledge from it before I did. So this was not a preistine sedan body. I sold off the front clip, rear, doors and fenders etc. afterwards







7 main, forged & counter weighted crank - factory






Left: 69' sedan CV / Right: 930 (relieved) CV




The INTAKE ports on this engine are outragious. I mean you could lose a baseball down one of these ports. That plus the twin TB's just seems to be some serious over kill. Yet if you run the number for ITB's, they come out sized far smaller than the factory intakes ports themselfs. Seems like it's counter productive to "reduce" prior to hitting the intake ports? This whole subject of "flow" is understanding that 4+4=9, to me.

Call me crazy. But this is why I'm gong to try the 6 Ducati TB's I pickedup. They measure ~52 just below the butterfly. Ouch! And I won't even devluge what the stack size is.. But they are sweet. They have a uber taper and a rare feature I"m finding out.. Idel/air bleeds!

They are a machining work of art comparied to the snowmobile and other samples I've picked up. They are just on the GIANT side. Well, at least with EFI, it's doable as compaired to a wet intake (I understand).

I've mentioned before. I'm not trying for more HP and or TQ. On the contrary. In fact I'm willing to give some up (~10-20hp?) near the low end so that I can clean up the whole engine bay and give it that "old school 6 stack" weber look. Sadly I would be breaking my vow of "function over form :o\ Not to mention that the weight savings is huge comparied to that cast oem manifold. I'll post what the engine weights are, fully dressed and on a diet. Subaru put some serious iron on this engine in the form of add-ons. The cast exhaust manifold for one. eGads! (BTW, they are history!)

I'm sure of it now. ITB's are a mental desease! A sickness.. A monky on ones' back. And I'm living proof! I spend way to much time dreaming about what could be instead of what is. I will, however, run it with the factory intake to at least give me a feel for what the factory power is like. If I went straight to ITB's, I would have no reference. Now to mention I don't want to take on the EFI and 6 TB's all at once. Not possible.



** I came to findout (later) that I am not going to be satisfied with a bus box with "only" 4 gears. There is just not enough forward gears, period. With the torque of this motor, I don't need numerically tall gears. I have always admired newer (automatic?) transmissions. Loafing down the freeway, 75 at ~2k. Now that's a freeway flyer. These bus boxes are also not rated for the torque (HP really isn't the proper measurement to choose a transaxle - Eng torque is what makes or breaks them). I believe this engine is around 220 foot pounds. The amount of $$ I would have to put into a, say, 091 to get it to stand-up to the load.. would be high. And I'm still left wanting more gears. And I love to shift!




3rd and 4th gear need attention. Both fine tooth!




HEY! THAT WAS EASY!!! :smile:
[41 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 15:39:16 Thu May 17 2012]

  
KARMANN_67
06:49:02 Sat
Nov 24 2007

Offline
20 posts
Dreamer

Reply
Re: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6

SIMPLY, VERY PROFESSIONAL, CLEAN.

  
EG33
20:29:38 Sat
Nov 24 2007

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6

Hi Kar-Man

Thank you for your kind words. I appreciate it...


Take care.
Randy
Long Beach, Ca. USA
[remove]randy@microimage.net
[3 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 03:45:53 Tue Dec 11 2007]

  
809cruz
00:27:50 Sun
Dec 2 2007

Offline
3 posts
Dreamer

Reply
Re: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6

upffff



the transxle is 100% stock?

  
EG33
05:57:39 Sun
Dec 2 2007

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6

Hey 809'er!!

re: CoMpLeTeLy StOcK TrAns
?


Yeah... yeah.... I just have a fondness for being stuck on the side of the road. :shocked:.

I am (was) hoping that my completely STOCK sized, future Coker TIRES would "cut me a break".. so to speak

I know that rear engined cars have unbeatable traction. But trying to hook-up these might be interesting

Although I swear I did hear somewhere that BIAS tires have edge (design wise) on traction? Disregarding the contact area

[Update] Just tracked down the BIAS reference to performance: From what I just read, Bias tires have a lower rolling-resistance that a simlar Radial. I was way off on the "traction" comment.



In the mean time, this is what I'll do until I can get a chance to build some bEEf into the trans. Steep learning curve.

That is, I'm hoping? to get very little traction out of thoes stock tires... at least from a standing start. I will depend on breaking the tires before I break the transaxle. And of course I'll show amazing restraint when leaving stop lights (he said) :wink:

The "project" goal is to have my 67' look completely stock on the ouside.. which includes factory type BIAS tires. It shouldn't get any attention as it goes by ether. I plan on Lexis level DB's out the exhaust. Super quite.

I "have to do" all the trans work myself (hard expensive knocks expected). Will have a break and fix policy. I actually have 3 091's of various years to play with. Just some personal abuse I "need" to take on... Automatic transmissions not withstanding... Doing my own transaxle work is the "last fronteer"!!
Just guessing (and I could use advise in this area). Some of the no-brainer upgrades I should be doing are possibly:

-in no particular order-

* Welded hubs
* Extra set of spiders
* Hardened Keys
* Lose the "fine tooth" 3rd and 4th
* Upgrade to (additional) hand packed needle bearings
* ahhhh... ok, just exhausted the catch phrases..
* But if $$ wasn't an issue? Mendola! Ka'ching!!

Also sticking with the 4:57 to help the freeway speeds..

Your comments are appreciated...

Randy
Long Beach, Ca. USA
[remove]randy@microimage.net
[2 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 06:13:35 Sun Dec 2 2007]

  
809cruz
02:45:08 Sat
Dec 8 2007

Offline
3 posts
Dreamer

Reply
Re: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6


I have a project with motor EJ22 But I do not have sufficient money for a trans, and state looking for a trans does not break, and I think that type 2 is a good option..,, Ď?


  
EG33
07:21:16 Sat
Dec 8 2007

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6

Hi CruZer

Well,
IMHO you can put just about any transaxle you want in your ride. It will take you to work, school or home just like any "regular bug". It just depends how you (we) treat it.

Frowned upon


Torque is the killer. (among other things). Putting your foot "in it" from a dead stop or slow crawl.. somethings got to give. What ever the weekest link is. The dynamics arn't the same if you step on it while traveling at speeds (50+).

But from a standing start... adding some sticky or oversized tires... instead of "breaking" the tires... you'll move up the chain and break something in the trans. You can even break the stock trans with the stock engine if it isn't treated right. Say, one tire in the dirt and the other on some sticky asphalt? Even a dream $4K trans will give up the farm at some point....

I'll be putting a completely stock 091 in my ride for now. I'm not worried about breaking it. If it never broke I wouldn't have anything to work on :smile: I'm just hoping when it does, it will be just a single gear and I can limp home. lol

At least I'll be running stock (thin) sized tires and the bug will be generally be pretty light because I'm keeping it on a diet. That's two things I have on my side over this same trans being in a stock bus or heaver vehicle.. he said :smile:

Anyway, no personal experience. Just trying to predict the future. I'm sure there are more than a few Transaxle WiZZards reading this board who would have much better (hands on experience &) input than I. Now if we could just get them to "ring in"... But it's been pretty quite. Maybe I should bring up religion or politics?

So suspect if I drive it normally... and don't try to "rotate the earth", I'll be able to scoot around in it until I have something more suitable.

Thanks for "ringing in"....
Your thoughts or comments?

Randy
[1 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 21:02:34 Sat Dec 8 2007]

  
809cruz
13:02:46 Mon
Dec 10 2007

Offline
3 posts
Dreamer

Reply
Re: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6

which speaks welded huds



Like?

  
EG33
03:40:09 Tue
Dec 11 2007

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6

Hey CruZe!

If you're taking about keeping the hubs from spinning

You're right!

Having the Syncro hubs welded up would be the least I could do? I may not play with the gears, fine tooth or not. But welded hubs should be a no-brainer






Is that what you meant?


Randy
[6 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 08:07:43 Wed Dec 12 2007]

  
surfbeetle
02:14:31 Sun
Jan 6 2008

Offline
4 posts
Dreamer

Reply
Re: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6

how far did you have to move the trans forward to fit under the decklid? How much longer is the 6 cylinder subaru engine over the ej20 turbo?

  
BugaRu
00:29:36 Thu
Jan 10 2008

Offline
87 posts
Almost Serious

Reply
Re: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6

Hi Randy aka EG33

Noticed your build and must say itís looking good. I can also relate to your situation about your 091 Bus trans. I would think that the 091 Bus trans should hold up ok as long as you donít dump the clutch too much. But then again after going through all of your hard work and efforts dumping the clutch is something that will be hard not to do? I would think that the most difficult part of running your current Bus Box gearing along with your new engine is not having enough top end gearing thus winding up some high revís to obtain highway speeds forcing your engine to run hotter and rev much higher then one would prefer. Of course as you know running taller tires would help a little but your going to have to go really tall to help compensate for the original 091 Bus box gearing. Keep in mind that the original Bus box was designed for approximately 70 hp engine to move a heavy VW Bus whereas your be doing the opposite and applying 300+HP to a very light Bug. Not trying to talk you into anything but after doing all of your hard efforts a little more time and effort into the trans now could save you a lot of downtime, and possibility more driving time down the road. By the way John over at OutBack is getting about 1000HP out of his 3.3 Subaru engine powered sand rails.

Attached is one of my Web pages, perhaps you seen this car in the Huntington Beach Area?
http://bugaru.com/wst_page2.html

Best of Luck 2-U. Jon



---
Fast Cars, & Slow Women makes me Drool
 
 
tinman4ma
03:06:53 Fri
Oct 31 2008

Offline
2 posts
Dreamer

Reply
Re: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6

Hey mr. looks good i am putting the same motor in my car a 1973 baja i was wondering if the intake manifold could be turned around or not i will try to post some pict's in a little bit

  
BRI7070
20:10:03 Sat
Dec 26 2009

Offline
4 posts
Dreamer

Reply
Re: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6

Randy, Its been awhile any updates?

  
geedub
07:24:44 Thu
Nov 17 2011

Offline
1 posts
Dreamer

Reply
Re: 67' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6

Hi any more progress dude with this conversion I am considering it.Ihave currently got an ej 20 t fitted in a 1303 and am very keen to see if the ez 30 or ez30r actually fitsand how much longer is the ez compared to the ej engines.your help would be realy appreciated as I am about to start the preperation ie looking for an engine etc.All the best

  
EG33
05:03:59 Tue
May 1 2012

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
7 Yr itch? Re: 56' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6 v2.0

DANGER
7 year data dump J8oO


Wow.. The last time I was posted was almost 5+ years ago? Ah, felt like 12 months! Seriously. Don't know what to say.. I guess life has a way of getting in the way :o\ Not to mention the lack of money for a project that seemed to keep escalating.

Since then.... I have worked on the project, on and off. Like the guy who builds a cement sailboat in his back yard.. I guess it's a life long project? I don't think an hour has gone by that I don't try to envision how to get around some technical problem. And I have given my self a fair amount. But I thought I woudl list some of the main changes since then. I like to call it my 67' EG33 Bug 2.0

1st.
It's no longer a 67' :o) At some point about a year ago I searched and found a 56' oval body (no pan). An oval has always been a got'ah-have. I'm still using the 69 IRS pan that I've highly modified.



2nd.
That 091, 002 then 091 transaxle game I was playing finally wore me out. I just couldn't get any of these transaxles to give me the right gearing. It was either super low gearing or near super low gearing. I want a uber freeway flyer. There is only so much you can do with 4 gears. So I started looking for more gears. Long story short. I ended up with an insanely expensive G64/G50 hybird 6 speed out of a 993.This trans is rated slighty above the torque and hp of the EG33. So for once I will have a transaxle that is up to the task. Gearing; The calculator tells me it at 7,000 it would be doing about 180. Of course that's goofy.. But it does tell me that I will be loafing at 70. I had to buy it out right, no core, complete rebuild with a few mods. First the bell housing was shortened about 1" to pull that big ass motor forward. Then I had the nose mount (which are normally HUGE) shortened. It started life as a G64/6 all wheel drive. I purchased it from California Motorsports in AZ. They removed the all-wheel drive and crazy long nose mount and finished it off with a sweet billet/engraved endplate (that nobdoy will ever see). They were GREAT!

Another silver lining was that the CV joints are much closer to the bell housing. That means that I can reduce the axle angle. I had no idea until I stuffed it in there and stood back. I really didn't even think of that dimension as "negotiable". I now believe that my axles will have less deflection (angle) that I first suspected. They say that my relieved 930 CV's are good up to 28'. I had put a cap at 15'. Now I believe they will be about 10'. Less angle the better.

Of course it will receive a 3/4 cage and coilovers to carry the weight of the eng and trans, since I kicked the crotch out the torshion tube :o) The pan horns won't be baring the majority of the load.



Of course Kennedy had everything I needed for the flywheel and PP. All aluminum, super light. Especailly when you see what insanity Porsche did with the OEM one. I think it takes two peope to lift it!.. Sadly, going this direction was expen$ive. The $%@! clutch disk is about $160 I think.. Actually, I try not to think about it (haven't bought it yet:smile:



3rd.
The first EG33 I had (out of a wrecking yard) was found to have been hit in the front passenger side of the cams. Just enough to have cracked the front housing, which is removable. . I only discovered it when I put some oil in it prior to turning it over to test my ECU (no plugs or fuel). Oil started to drip immediately. I've always imagined (worried) what happens to an engine in a hard impact.. the invisible things. Now imagine that this engine was going in a plane? eGads! Are the cams or anything else affected? Not visually. But I'll just have to assume that it's jacked.. I mean we are talking 1,000ths? But now that engine is in question. So I impulse bought another engine that was fantastic. And I have the 1st to experiment with.. aka rip apart and never put back together. Or at least make all my "porting mistaks" on it!



4th
I have some pretty wild radiator thoughts.. But to jump to the chase, I'm planning on mounting two smaller sized radiators on the floor where rear passengers would have placed their feet (not any more! What are passengers?). Air will be picked up (scooped) from underneath. To get the "differential pressure" to work for me, I want to run (a low profile) from the floor to below the rear window, out of sight, to the air lovered air intake below the window. Which I believe to be a low-pressure spot as air rushes over the top of the roof. It will be sealed off from the eng compartment. The slightest 1" scoops (rubber?) on the bottom with ambiend (higher) air pressure and low pressure at the top.. I think I can produce the flow I need. With some fans for low speeds situations.. Going off the deep end I even picked up a magnehelic differential gauge and a large scale model oval body for some fun filled testing.. I've also toyed with the idea of a (what I like to call) a passive radiator. Finned copper tubing running up and down the pan bottom.. There is a lot of turbulent air down there. I sure would like to put it to use. Just an idea to keep my mind occupied..

5th
In my endless effort to temp fait, I've WIDENED the frame horns to make room for the G50 and I think I've shortened the pan another 1".. So it's now >5"! For anyone who may have missed this part. To get this oversized EG33 in, I shortened the pan (behind the rear seats) to suck the engine forward, which in turn draws the engine and Trans forward. Leaving the body untouched. So to eliminate the "ass hanging out syndrome'. I then had box swing arms (off road) made that same amount (longer). This will put the stub axles back to the OEM position. I just ran across a bathtub Porsche that is also using this longer trainling arm to stuff a GIANT turo motor in. So its obviously it's not a new idea.
Of course I'm using IRS. So now the axles deflect backwards at an angle. Which is really no different than a "raised" bug, with the axles deflecting down. Well, that is the plan.
I also opted for pan rail reinforcements. Like the vert's factory supports. Boy! Did that stiffen up the entire pan. I highly suggest you buy into these. Other wise it's really the body (below the doors) supporting most of the weight and flex on the outer perimeter.







** I had these swing arms made. I got some pretty strange looks when I aked for them to be 5x0 (LxW). At least I think that's the dimensions. Been a while. I have the invoice around here somewhere.


*** Torshion tube "brace" is temporary.. until the tubing work is in. I used MicroStub axles (GM floating bearing housing) to get the widest distance between the trans CV and the wheel CV. Just to lessen the axle deflection that much more (via' longer axles).








6th
I've stressed (actually enjoying the think time) of the issue with the gigantic oil pan.. A real party killer. Well, when I was moving the engine around I removed the oil pan and replaced it with a flat wood cover cut to shape (lot easier to set her down)The light bulb went on. Once I had it in the car on a pre-fit.. There was TONS of ROOM! In fact, the Trans actually was the lowest point under the car. So I'm going with a dry-sump. Just for the clearance alone. It will also help with the sleeper effect. Not to insanely expensive either.. $1200 or so. Not to mention.. that is a 1st class oiling sytem on the race track.





7th
Rack and Pinion or die! I want to make this car "controlable" at speed. And my experiences with old bug steering is a white knuckler. So I starting thinking about retrofitting the bug with R&P. I started with 914/912/911 racks (I have three now!).. then realized that these will not limit the "bump steer" as much as I would have liked. they work on Porche's because they use McPherson struts.. What I really need is a "center steer" rack. To make the tie rods as long as possible. I finally found the right rack. 85-91 Chevy Cavalier manual rack.This also puts the steering shaft more in line with the oem steering. I think it was about $160 as a re-man. These racks are as smooth as butter with zero play as compaired to the vw boxes. That plus a bunch of castor and maybe I can get high speeds runs down to a pucker factor 3 instead of 10?

** Surprisingly, the Porshe unit is actually heaver. Surprise! Who would have guessed.




In the last 3 months I have turned up the heat on getting this thing going (thinking end of summer 2012) I allowed lots of things to slow me down. I just picked up a metal cutting vertical band saw for all the mounts I'm going to need to make. And speciality tools to keep me broke. Even spun aluminum wheels. Which has nothing to do with the stuff I should have been doing.

I did just get the pan under the car over this last weekend.. I've have more room than I ever expected in the eng compartment. I believe enough to stuff a full dress EG33 in there. The one I've been test fitting is stripped down. But would ony need a intake (ITB's?) and a alternator to make it run. Also, removing a pile of weight and make the eng look like it's a classic flat 6 with Webbers.. I even bought a few sets of Ducati 999 throttle bodies (shower injected no less), but will wait till I run the OEM configuration to get a sense of its power. That Subee engine is build so well, all I could do is jack it up.. and slow it down. But I would like to run ITB's for the reduced weight and look!. I couldn't improve on what Subaru did so I'm hoping that if I do get ITB's on it, the HP/TQ stays close to the same. Will see.



I also made head way (during one of those years?) on the ECU.. After everything I've read, I was more than worried because there are no engine maps for this engine (that anybody is sharing).. So even the simplest thing becomes difficult. You literally have to tell a engine how to fart. The ECU is probably one of the most challenging things of this whole project. It can do a million things.. (and they better be right).. So I found a way to spin it over (no plugs) to test out the sensors. I'm able to watch with a PC USB O-scope. Can't imagine how this could be done without a Scope. Unless you have a real popular engine and it just takes loading a map to get it started. I read stories about guys that melted their starters down to the ground.. Using this O-scope I was able to get my crank and cam triggers down. And the settings were nowhere close to what I would have guessed them to be.. So it already paid for itself.








p.s.
Why did I choose the the heart burn of a EG33 when the EZ and newer 6cyl boxers are shorter? I think somebody told me it couldn't be done. I have to admin, they have been right so far.. But I'm back at it :smile:

Also, you can build the EG33 physically BIGGER. I don't plan on running it pressurized aka Turbo etc, Only NA. I think it's really about where you're going to spend most of your time driving. If you are at the drags, then a screaming turboed Subee 4-banger would rock - no queston! But for enjoyable day to day street and freeway driving, at low RPM's, where you spend 90% of your time?... There is no replacement for displacement IMHO. Future plans are to GO BIG on the sleeves and stroke it by re-grinding the crank. A 3.7 with ITB's is it's future.

I do see that this board has been pretty quite. Most replys are in the 2009/10 range.. But its all pretty timeless. If you go back through the posts and the wealth of photos.. It's a spectacular cache of knowledge and experiences. I"m going back through as much as I can to gather lots of good info and probably the most important, the "bug" so to speak. It can really wind you up all over again.

There must be a lot of mid-projects that are sitting (like mine).. If you search Google for conversion like this, bbboy.net shows up pretty fast. So it still must be inspiring builders? I'll see if keep this tread going some more, posting photos as I take them.

I need to get this running. I have been driving a mini-van. Nuff said.

Cheers!
Randy
Long Beach, Ca. USA!
[24 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 14:05:09 Thu Jun 7 2012]

  
EG33
04:14:42 Sun
May 6 2012

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 7 Yr itch? Re: 56' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6 v2.0

Progress! What are the odds?

I've been working on getting the engine to nest without interference. So far I've been using just the long-block without the intake or accessories. But now I need to get the intake manifold on and see where I need to "relieve" more sheet metal. It's been painstaking to try and keep removing a little at a time as to retain as much of the factory metal as possible. I know that the firewall needs to get moved back and up about 4" to clear the front part of the intake manifold. Amazingly, you can "flip" the intake manifold around and have the twin TB's pointing the opposite direction. It just bolts up like it was meant to be. Here is the manifold in the factory position.



Here it is reversed. I do have a fall back plan. If for some reason it just won't give me the room to get fresh-air to the intake, I'll go with ITB's. More work to get it to run correctly with the EFI. Linkage issues etc. It would be "problematic" :smile: as compaired to the factor TB


And in the car




I can see from this photo, I've got room to "go back" some more! Every little bit helps the CV deflection. It's really not deflecting very much right now. But less is more. Actually, I think I read somewhere that you always want some deflection, as it excersizes the CV joints and distributes the grease (I guess if you never hit a bump in your life). I don't know if that has any truth, but it's interesting to ponder.





I was able to do this with minimal invasion into the cab. And the piece I remove can possibly be flipped around and used enclose the opening, as shown.



A day or so ago I started to strip down the 2nd engine and remove most of the un-needed parts (and weight). I had mentioned earlier that my first engine has been hit in front (seller forgot to mention that? again!) and cracked a cam (front) cover. My 2nd engine looked great. Well almost. On closer inspection I spotted the front cam "plastic cover" cracked in one spot. So far it's in a place where the belt is on the opposite side, no metal. But this is another great example of these so called JDM engines being in accidents instead of the more popular beliefs that Japan just sends them over after 40K (I think that's the miles). I even spotted broken glass that had fallen underneath the intake. Supporting a front accident theory at some point. So it's nice having double parts of everything!



Tool Tip!
Makita GD0800C
This is by far the BEST cut off tool I've ever owned. Bar none. I got so tired of having a screaming compressor running for several minutes just so I can bleed the (garage sized) tank down in the same about of time. Then wait for the tank to build pressure again :o\ And the air cut off tool looses power at the same rate the pressure drops. My ears were killing me and I had enough.



I picked up this Makita "porting/cut off/die grinder" and never looked back. It beats the hell out of that dam air powered cut off wheel nightmare. It's quiet, "always ready" and has a ton of power (far more than the air tool could dream of IMHO). It has a 1-10 speed setting and I've never moved it off of 2. It also adjusts the torque depending on the load. I highly recommend this tool if you are doing a conversion. And yes, I have Sawzalls, angle hand grinders, torches, mig, vertical band saw etc.. But I use this one the most. I remember it was a bit pricey however :o\ I believe about $215/Amazon.

Any hoot. I got a lot done as I head toward getting everything posistioned and confirmed. I need to get the 3/4 cage, supports and coil-overs in to carry that engine and trans on its own. Not depending on the pan or the frame horns for the main support. I'll be back at it Sunday.

Cheers!
Randy, Long Beach, Ca. USA
[6 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 05:00:58 Wed May 16 2012]

  
EG33
03:17:24 Mon
May 7 2012

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 7 Yr itch? Re: 56' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6 v2.0

Sun.
Well, I didn't knock it out of the park today! Seems I spent all my energy on Saturday :o\ So I took it easy.
I did still need to check to see if the rear wheels will land in the center of the fender wells. Since every part effects another, it's kind of like the chicken and the egg.

So I mounted up the the wheels to see if my pan shortening matched my swing arms so than the rear stub axles are centered in the wheel wells. I kept thinking its going to turn out like one of thoes 60's altered wheel base drag cars where they move the rear axlet forward like three feet.



Especially since I cheated on the length of the pan by shortening it a bit more than the swing arms were long. Hoping to move the eng/trans "forward" (along with the wheels) to gain an additional 3/4" at the rear of the engine and without looking to obvious. Luckly, it is all worked. But yes, it's all quite confusing :oP I could have skipped shortening the pan completely, but that would have sent the trans about 5" further forward in the pan. And it's so wide and long (that's what she said!) that there wouldn't be much of the pan and support horns left, IMHO. For some reason I just wanted to retain the oem pan look & layout. Even if its just used as reference points.

** The car is obviously sitting way to high. The back is off the ground and these wheels are just "rollers". Not my pride and joys. You can make out the mue'macho frame rails running down the sides. This should aid in transfering the power into the pan and forward and giving extra stiffness to the body. I'm going to be running roll bar sized tubing from side to side, through the tunnel at just above floor level in a couple of key locations. This [should] keep the upright stationary so I don't have to run a cage forward. I just can't bring myself to run verticals down each A-pillar. I'm sure I will remembe that when I'm rolled over in a ditch?





The front is still sitting pretty high. And I want to get the whole car down, way down "evenly" - no heavy front rake or tail dragging. Luckly, the IRS in the back is near 0 camber since I swaped the L&R. Initally, it had some pretty heavy neg camber due to these being offroad arms. I'm guessing the builder expected any vehicle that these when on would be sitting pretty high?.
Front; I've even have 2 1/2" dropped spindles on it. Of course there is weight that it's not carrying; fuel tank & fuel, spare, seats, bumpers, me!.. But adjusters will still need to go in.
The dropped spindles have a side effect of wideing the track, but I don't see much sign of that.. The wheels seem to be in about the stock posistion. The beam will be narrowed as I don't want to have to run 135's. I prefer just a little more rubber under the front wheels. So 165's should do it.



The "back wheel track" is perfect. WIth the offset of factory wheels, I could go 195's. I always had a wild hair about using ultra-light spun wheels.. And I had already picked up a set of CMS wide-fives. And have wanted Bogarts recently. But after looking at how the wheels are tucking in so nicely, and that my offset is gong to get about a inch wider. I might just get some real (straight) smoothees and the period caps and be done with it.
By the way.. the photos show the condition of the body . Well, the skanky paint (love it!) every ding, dent will stay exactly as it is. The engine (exhaust) will be Lexus quite. Since the theme is a uber SLEEPER.. In fact the CMS wheels were going to be painted as to help deguise it's true purpose.



Now I know things are fitting up, I can think about barrowing my friends Model3 tube bender to fit up the main roll hoop and coil over supports to carry the weight of the eng, trans and back half of the body/pan. As a incentive I bought him a additional tubing-die (exactly the size I needed?) and both of us BendTech software to make the bending more accurate. I've already created the cage in the software, bit of a learning curve. If I can find the %@#% thing I'll post it as an example of what it can do. Of course I am just learning :O)

FOUND IT!
This is one of my early trys using the BendTech software. It's 3D and all the bend points can be generated and then applied to the tube bender. The forward diag's will reach a little farther forward (only limited by seating interference). And the coil-overs will pickup the load where the rear tubes collide. Also, the horn to upper tube is not to scale. The pan horizontal tubing will attach to the pan brace supports that now run down both sides of the car. Also, not shown, will be a bus like support under the pan horns + any other supports and strengthing that is needed. The sofware also generates the fish-mouth wrap around print outs..

If done correctly, the engine and trans should be self-supporting, with the coil overs taking the entire load. So it's really not the main hoop etc that is trying to carry the engine. But the other way around. All the tubing attached to the forward pan is really just to join the two halfs. At least that's the way I have been thinking it will be. You should be able to lop the pan off ahead of the nose cone and it would all stand on it's own (I keep telling myself :smile: This will be fun :o]



I still have lots of things to keep me busy. One is getting that 85(to 91')' Cavalier manual center-steer rack posistioned and mounts made. The exhaust tubing mapped out. And then the ECU 8oO This will make the cooling sytem and exhaust seem like child's play...


Cheers!
Randy Long Beach, Ca. USA
Remember, I'm not a professional car builder, but I do play one on TV

[24 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 14:19:07 Fri May 11 2012]

  
EG33
18:03:23 Thu
May 10 2012

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 7 Yr itch? Re: 56' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6 v2.0

Quick post while I'm waiting for the weekend (and more project money!).

If you have a SVX or just the EG33 engine, here are some factory manuals covering lots of SVX related subjects. I've uploaded the files to "dropbox". You can download them all or pick and choose them individually from the web link below. You can also "read them on the fly" prior to downloading, depending on your browser's abilities.

Dropbox
(https://www.dropbox.com/sh/1hk36ygwiigisqu/_GJVkM8yfg)




They arn't very large as PDF's are pretty compact. So they should download pretty fast.

Cheers!
Randy
[9 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 14:29:44 Fri May 11 2012]

  
EG33
04:28:18 Sun
May 13 2012

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 7 Yr itch? Re: 56' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6 v2.0

Eng&Trans on the move - backwards?

After the last pre-fit, I realized that I could push the engine and trans back one more inch! I just need to relieve some interference at the upper left and right cam covers. Of course this is all to lower the CV angle (rearward) deflection to as low as possible.

The covers are already off.. which saves "inches". When I first remove the cover(s) I had no idea that they really cover nothing! As there are no actual "external cam gears (pullies)" on the top two cams. As you might imagine, the "rub" is higher and wider on the engine. The bottom cams have lots of room. I knew going in that these two points along with just under the center of the deck lid would be challenging. After all the time I've been messing with it, I only really found out that it would actually fit and be able to maintain a reasonable CV angle, in the last week.. And here I just bought a Costco sized bottle of TUMS

With the top covers off I will need to enclose the (top surface) of the bottom half of the covers. Actually, I'll be able to replace the covers, leaving quite a lot of the cover. Then just taking care of the exposed area just above the belot. Leaving them open to the environment (with that Gilmer cam belt) would be problematic. With a rear engine configuration, foreign objects are guaranteed.

With the covers off, I saw that the engine can still go back more. I just need to get creative with my cut off wheel and remove some areas of the cover backing. Removing the circled areas are what is allowing me to go back another inch.





So that will [finally] set the eng/trans dimension, fore and aft. I can now remove the floor pan [again], move the temporary trans mount back 1" to the final position. Cut off the cam cover protrusions then put it all back in again to see if it's really good to go. This is really what's holding up the BIG stuff. Like installing the structural tubing/roll bar etc.

Here is a shot of how much material I needed to remove from the firewall... Not too bad. At least itís not a chop top or a shortened 23 window?.. I remember a old article from a 60's magazine that described how to upgrade your "oval window" to a more modern 58' and later larger rear window. It may have been from Germany. The two guys were wearing white lab coats and it looked like it was all professional done.



I also was able to get the weight on the EG33. Minus ALL the crap. I did get a exact weight on a fully dressed EG33 and a complete 1600. But have since lost track of them. That's why it's being weight dissembled.

I would need to add a flywheel and PP (I have a lightened flywheel and a aluminum PP), Intake (ITB's would be very light. But I would still need the shorty oem manifolds to get them attached. But they are pretty light. Throttle bodies direct-to head is way too short. Unless I want to spin it to 12K and up?), Alternator (thinking of one of the small race units), front pulley (I ditched the 347LB stock one and went with a very light aluminum one. This engine is one of the most balanced designs on earth, short of a Wankle, so I think I can live without the harmonic balancer, he said), oil pan and oil. Of course I'll get a complete wet running weight when I get closer. Then I can see what the real weight penalty is.



Not too bad (even as a long block) when compared to a 1600 vw engine. Which I believe it about 250lbs. A lot of the weight is in the form of all the heavy duty add-ons. .. The cast iron exhaust manifolds are just unbelievable! The intake too. But this is why this engine has a "built like a brick s%&! house" reputation. It is.




Back at it tomorrow!
Cheers
Randy, Long Beach, Ca. USA!

[4 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 05:10:45 Sun May 13 2012]

  
EG33
04:55:28 Wed
May 16 2012

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 7 Yr itch? Re: 56' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6 v2.0

Size matters!

Sunday I "removed" the engine, then the pan and trans once "again" :o\ That is getting old. When it's just one person it does take some time. And I'm freaked out about launching the body off the stands I have it on. All it would take is one misstep and that's all she wrote. It's not like I'm gong to catch it. Well, maybe I could just once. But then it would become someone elses project? Oh no Mr. Bill!

So right now I'm waiting for project cash to start flowing again, hopefully soon!. So I thought I would take a closer look at the cam covers on the Subee and try to squeeze down its size a bit more. The covers are what it interfering with the rear of the engine compartment.

It's amazing how I get all side tracked with the smallest thing. I was fixated on a couple of plastic tabs on the covers that were interfering with the rear compartment. But since this my "extra" beater engine that I don't have to worry about putting back together (right), I thought I would delve a little deeper. aka Plow into it!


Covers off, belt loosened. It crossed my mind on this photo is that I bet I could pickup power for a dry sump pump by having it take the place of the one, upper right idler pulley (reposistioned above the block). The dry sumps normally use Gilmer belts and run 50% of engine speed. This means I would need to use a larger cogged pulley to drive it. Can't imagine it being the size of the cam pulleys. but I'll see what can be done.. Then I would need to find a place for my "miniturized" Hondy A/C compressor and alternator... I also could just stop talking about it and like Niki, JUST DO IT.


So I pulled [all] the pulleys and idlers off and be able to remove the last front cover.



If I'm not careful, this damn thing is going to disappear! That really opened the whole front up. I was able to eliminate all that plastic that was getting in the way. Of course I can't expose the belt to the elements. So I'll need to do something with that.



Of course the center cover really handles a bulk of the protection. And I can utilize the bottom of the L & R covers to cover the side and under sides.



This side was the one that was the closest. Since the cylinders are "staggered".. But I have the room I wanted. Now I can move the eng&trans back an additional inch.



The right side (as mounted in the car) has a ton or room. I might just have to mount my battery back here! :o)



One thing I noticed that was "interesting" (odd?) is the way the bottom cam pulleys are indexed on the cam shafts. You would think that a woodruff key would be the locator.. As per this photo;



But surprise!
Itís this little pin that has been located in each pulley. It sits in the woodruff key groove. I guess the factory may have wanted to utilize a pulley from another motor... Just a wild guess. I will say that this is the 1st "design que" that doesn't match up with what I know to be the rest of the engine. that one small pin to turn over (2) cams, top and bottom? I guess if I was to look for a silver lining, it would be that it doesn't take as much torque to sping those cams as I would have guessed. And that pulley doesn't shoulder very much on the shaft end. When I slip it on, it goes about as half as far as one would expect. But this may be why Subaru has never asked me to help design their engines? :O]



On a completely different note, I was wondering if these Gilmer (cog) style belts make any undue noise on this engine. The same sound that a super charger (that classic whine) makes. On super chargers, that whine sound is made as the air gets trapped and squeezed out of all the slots as it spins. I've heard if you drill a small hole in between each cog, the sound goes away. Probably not what a SC owner actually wants? Hmmmmm.. I have a tiny drill. I wonder...

Next up is cutting out both floor pans (they needed it anyway). This will give me the room to properly weld in the roll bar(s) and tubing from below. So I will need to get some new L&R pans. Start getting the body ready for the elements.. I already have the POR15, Body Cavity coatings etc..

Then I can think about barrowing that Model3 tubing bender from my bud. That will be fun. I think if I can just "commit" to getting the main supports together and then off those jack stands & roller boards would be a major turning point... I know.. blaw blaw blaw

p.s.
I'm also going to take some photos of these JUMBO Ducati 999 "shower inj" throttle bodies (TB's) I have (that are obviously too large ~52'ish).. and try to make the case that I just might be able to run them... See, that's the sickness I was talking about. Denial!

Cheers!
Randy, Long Beach, Ca. USA!
"I am not a professional car builder, but I do play one on TV.."
[11 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 16:03:36 Thu May 17 2012]

  
EG33
05:01:24 Wed
May 23 2012

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 7 Yr itch? Re: 56' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6 v2.0

;0\ Days have past... So wat's the hap?

I'm cleaning out my garbage garage as we speak.. I admit it, I am the king at disorder and kaos! Once I rolled the pan back in to get it cleaned up and welded together.. well, I just had NO ROOM to work. I would need to be a gymnast to get from one side to the other, alive... So I finally decided to lose the helmet, shin guards and shoulder pads and clean this mother up!

I should start getting productive in the next day or so. Then the pan will get welded back together.. and it's got to be spot-on.

EG33 Conversions
"If you can't afford to have it done right, see us first..!"

[1 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 05:03:40 Wed May 23 2012]

  
EG33
18:25:01 Sun
May 27 2012

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 7 Yr itch? Re: 56' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6 v2.0

Sun/27th

The garage is somewhat livable now! That's something. But who am I kidding, it will never be "Popular Mechanics clean". I will always work in pig'dom. Somebody has too.

On another subject, I only stumbled across this a few weeks ago. Here a engine swapped 356 with the transaxle moved forwrard and the CV's angled backwards (as I am doing) to allow for a INSANELY GIANT 993 TURBO motor and 6 speed. To much to take in!





Rumor is it's could be a bit of a scary ride (ya' think?), Mainly in the corners or when getting on it hard. Being so tail heavy. Seeing this re-reminds me to keep my ride as light as possible and keep pushing weight to the front. I actually don't want to die.

Of course this oozes Ka'ching! I couldn't even afford the bare shell (which I understand they started with) no less all the other parts that are surly made out of pure un-obtanium. It was up for sale ($132K!) but has since been sold. So there isn't much on documentation now, shame! Here is the only info I can still find on it.

356 Link
BringATrailer.com 356 930 Turbo 6 speed

There should be a whole write up on this thing.. Way out of my reach.. Except for having the same trans, I've gone uber cheap.. But the process is the same. However at a slight cost increa$e /:o] At least I know my should work, as it's not original... Of course I think offroad cars have been doing this for years.. for more wheel base. But it's almost always with a wider track..


Back to planet earth!
Progress. The pan is back on stands again and I've got room to work (room? it's all relative). I picked up more of the adjustable lift stands to support the pan. I had to leave my current set under the body, out on the driveway.. Saving me lots of time and effort.

Pan-stands:
I use these because I can fine tune their height. That plus two 8' framing levels and a few smaller ones, I can be sure that it all goes back together straight and true. If I was to build it off the of the garage floor? My floor is like a skate park. It would end up all kattywompus. I basically use the levels to create a virtual level surface, add a plumb-bob and you can really true things up, IMHO. No matter what surface you are building on.

Now I can start separating the pan-half's now, so I can clean out the tunnel prior to welding the two back together. I want to get all the brackets and metal crap pieces out of there.. I'm not sure how I'm going to do that. Hopefully there are corresponding spot welds I can drill out from the outside to release all the backetry. If not, I can always leave them.. But I won't be happy about it..

I'll degrease the tunnel and then coat the inside with a 3M "body cavity" coating that doesn't harden completely, which I understand is similar to diesel fuel + wax. I picked up a Schultz (spray) gun along with a uber long flexible extension that sprays a 360' pattern. I'll also "seam seal" the outside then coat with semi-black POR15, I have a 10gal can of sound-deadening coating and I picked up a couple of pounds of those sound deadening micro-spheres that get mixed with paints.. just for experimenting.. But it will be impossible to tell if it is effective.. as I won't be able to try with and without.

I basically want it ultra quite (including the exhaust). Yes, I've reached that age. What I like to call "Lexus quite". When you see the amount of thick tar-board they used on the tunnel, it makes you wonder what was VW trying to accomplish. I guess thats one-big-long-tube (at least that's what the girls tell me) that may act like a giant sound amplifier? Like a trumpet running down the center of your car. Just guessing.

Also, when you look at the beam front end, everything is solid to the pan.. It's continuous metal to metal, starting at the drum, to the ball joints, control arms, beam to pan head. I wonder if anyone has placed a thin layer of hard rubber just behind the four places the beam mounts to the pan head. Nothing that would allow movement of course, but maybe to decouple the sound a bit. I don't want to have to take out a loan for boat load of Dynamat Xtreme. Those people must be filthy rich by now!

The only hardware that I plan to have in the tunnel is the shift rod. I was thinking of some way to sound deaden the entire tunnel.. Secretly I would like to fill the whole dam thing with 2 part foam!! (with a tube to protect the shift rod). Now that would be quite. But I wouldn't' want to trap any moisture and create a huge problem in the future. I'll think of something that will go in that will also be removable. Meaning it won't glue itself to the inside. Hey! Nitrogen filled and crushed space shuttle tiles?


Cheers!
Randy, Long Beach, Ca. USA!
EG33 CONVERSIONS UNLIMITED
We sacrifice quality so that you can save.."
[10 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 20:07:33 Sun May 27 2012]

  
EG33
18:10:55 Sun
Jun 3 2012

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 7 Yr itch? Re: 56' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6 v2.0

BACK TO THE FUTURE!
(with a dose of reality)


Well, I thought I was going to just weld the two pan half's back together... It sounds like the next step. However, I realized pretty quickly that wasn't going to fly, yet.



I already knew I was going to need to use Metal Prep, POR-15 and also body cavity wax (sounds un-nerving!) where I couldn't get the Por. So I had already purchased most of what I needed. It just seemed so easy to just hover the mouse over "BUY NOW" and "click"?



The thing is, I can't apply any of this stuff until ALL the welding and mods are done. Ya think? In past projects I use to just cut here.. mod there, rattle can it, bolt whatever it was up and GO. But I'm farther into this one than any of the others. And as time has passed.. I'm thinking about all the details more and more (possibly to much). Probably the single reason I've never "actually" painted a whole car. Over thinking about the 10,000 and 1 details on every square inch of the car.

And when I was prototyping stuffing this (oversized) engine and trans into my bug (not knowing what would fit and go where) I went hog wild with the torch, Sawzall and cut off wheel. Thinking... I take care of that later.. Crap. Later is apparently now.

I still have lots of clean up on the back half. Now that I know the trans fits. I can mount it back up and close up all the openings where I went to far. Not to mention beefing it up where it needs it. It doesn't have to be uber strong since a rear cage and coil-overs will be carrying the weight.



A quick check of the tunnel tells me that I needed to do some preventive maintenance. Actually not to bad considering that this pan is 43 years old.



I can't just follow the POR-15 directions and 1st spay it with Marine Clean (or other degreaser), wait.. then spray it with Metal Clean, then wash it all out with water and then use POR-15 (or the body cavity wax).. after it's dry? I really don't think 43 years is coming off that easily. Of course I did plan to use some "mechanical persuasion" on it too.


Actually, most of the tunnel looks pretty dam good IMHO. I apparently just need to address the front 20%. Treat it or protect it in some way before it's buttoned up for life. I guess I'm really doing this for future owners. The reality is, it will be eventually pried from my dying hands, some day.


After thinking about it, the light when on.. HIGH PRESSURE WASHER. I should at least rent a gas powered pressure washer to try and knock some of that scale off.. I also bought a chiming sweep (hard core, square wire brush) to try and apply some persuasion. I'll need to remove the pedal supports and dongles that are inside to clean it properly. I won't be using the factory pedal cluster any way. It will all be converted to hydraulic lines.

But I better be ready to move. And fast. Any bare metal will be vulnerable. Even though the Metal Ready does leave a nice coating that protects the surface for some amount of time. But that brings me back around to needing to get all the metal work done 1st.

So I just need to slow down a bit and finish up the pan half's. Which should rally include making the mounts for the Cavalier rack.. Also I need to degrease and protect the "inside" of the pan rails.. I'm thinking of prepping them then taping the bolt holes close and filling them with some POR.. letting it coat the inside.

Anyway, that's where I lost a bit of momentum. Live and learn? Maybe secretly I never want to finish because if it's actually completed, I'll apparently have no more purpose in life? Ohhh.. deep.


On another subject:
Here are those Ducati TB's I have. I ended up with 8 just in case I grow two extra cylinders. They are 52mm (ouch!). And were initially about $100 a pair/eBay. But strangly when I started to buy these.. I swear the prices started to sky rocket. I think the individual sellers thought there was a run on them. A few sets I bought for less than $100. now they are $150 and up. Since they are contained in a filtered fresh air box on the bike.. the used ones always look new..









To big? YOU BET. But that's all part of the TB love fest. You lose all reasoning. I've said in the past that I'm not trying to increase performance by moving to ITBs. Only to lose some serious weight (factory manifold components are insanely heavy). And to alter the engine's appearance to look more like a old-school bug with tri-Weber's :smile:

This is a to-scale photo. It's only slightly larger than the OEM intake port.. But the factory ports are already huge.. At least in this sense, it doesn't seem to outrageous



And of course for the full NUT-SO effect.. You got to have "shower injectors"! There is nothing like having fuel at 35Lbs+ on the atmosphere side of your throttle plates to warm a cold winter's night? Of course I would keep the Subee mid-manifold and use the factory injectors.. But they are a conversation piece.



If I can get ITBs installed and working.. I would just hope I don't end up with (much) less usable power. Which would be way too easy to do. Subaru obviously put some serious $ and thought into the factory intake. And all "I" can really do is seriously jack it up. However I'm even willing to lose up ~20hp to get the appearance and weight off. So I'm trying to be realistic.

Here are some of the other, lesser TB's I have.



I think both these sets are from snowmobiles. They are so crude and a serious lack the precision machining than the Ducati's (or other high end mfg). Of course being snowmobiles.. they weren't meant to be puss. They don't have "idle air bleeds".. which the 999's do. And fit and finish is like night and day. Especially where the butterflys fit. You can see all sorts of (uneven) daylight through the cheap ITBs.. where the 999's are amazing. All this has to add up to a smoother idle and low speed operation, I'm thinking.

If these came in 38's, 40's or even 42's.. I wouldn't be as concerned.. But 52's? I LOVE IT (->sick bastard!). And to add insult to injury.. the stacks are a whole lot larger, as the whole TB tapers all the way down. Which is very high end cool.

Even though the Ducati 999 has a similar displacement size as a individual cylinder on my engine, it of course was meant to rev way up to 11,500. That's why the TB are so large. My Subee will only see about 7k. Quite a difference. I have some HP to burn so it's worth the gamble.

Ok, enough blathering.. Back to business. I'll try to produce more than hot-air on the next installment


DISCLAIMER
I'm not a professional car builder but I do play one on TV

Cheers!
Randy
Long Beach, Ca. USA!
EG33 Conversion Unlimited
If you can't afford to have it done right, see us first!.


[17 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 21:10:50 Sun Jun 3 2012]

  
EG33
18:22:57 Mon
Jun 11 2012

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 7 Yr itch? Re: 56' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6 v2.0

Cheap Tool Find


Now I'm not the first to stumble across this air 16ga (max) punch/flanger, but I did take the plunge against my better judgment (not much of a plunge at $35?). I won't go into the pros and cons of Harbor Fright... But the great reviews on this inexpensive punch were hard to ignore.

I was looking for a way to attach panels. I can't stop thinking of rivets and welding the panels.. Or painstakingly drilling holes to "rose weld" the panels together. Which is a pain in the $#%* in sheet metal.

Then I found the Harbor Freight #01110 ($35!) after paroozing some metal forming sites.



I read enough reviews that it really seemed to be worth it. Well, I'm knocked over (at least) with the one I have. When I first tried the punch I thought it wasn't working. I heard just a quick psHssssst and nothing, Like it didn't pass through the panel (expected?) I did it again and realized that I was actually punching perfect holes with no effort. It just walked through the sheet metal with no effort. I'm not sure of the gauge. But the test scrap I used is from the rear-skirt area. It would punch fender gauge metal with no problem. Like a drunk at 2am, I wanted to punch everything in sight! And this tools using next to no air.. That's a first!

The photo above shows the holes I test punched. And it took no time at all. And if you look close, you can see I was also using the flanger on the left most holes. The punched holes could be bigger.. But all I really need to do is hit that spot through to the next panel with my mig. So there is enough room.
.
The flanger could be deeper. But it's enough to lap panels and make them fit up nice enough for my purposes. Flange a edge, knock out the holes, shoot some "weld through paint", then rose mig weld the panels together.. that plus seam sealer, undercoating etc.. and I think I can pull my interior together, finally.

Well worth the $35 IMHO. I don't expect to use this over months and years. Really just to get all my sheet metal in place and securely attached. I have been really scratching my head over how to fill all those voids in the pan I hacked out.. And do it in a way that doesn't look half ass.

p.s.
I did pay the $4.50 for insurance (->sucker!), but I can give it hell for up to a year and get a new one if it was to fail in any way..


Randy, Long Beach, Ca. USA!
[1 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 18:26:34 Mon Jun 11 2012]

  
EG33
06:26:26 Sun
Jun 17 2012

Offline
74 posts
Almost Serious


Reply
Re: 7 Yr itch? Re: 56' Bug w/Subaru 3.3L H6 v2.0

Panning for gold...

I'm getting myself bogged down as I address all the hacking, sawing, cutting and torching I did as I dreamed up ways to get this eng & trans to fit into my sedan. I didn't know exactly where it would need to go and I needed room to try all options. Red circle (photo) is just a small part of what I need to repair. Out of view is the inside frame horns and torsion bar. However it has enough room now (especially after scooting the trans back a few inches). It's official location is now one inch back from my last test-fit. Freeing up some CV angle. I was just going to set it and forget it but I think I toss it back into the car one-last-time.



The elements +time ganged up on the pan in a few spots. They needed to be fixed and are unrelated to the other major surgery. Generally, the pan is pretty solid, but a couple of spots must have had water pooled at those points. Because adjacent areas to these spots are solid. Iím going to make sure that the whole pan is seam sealed, rust protected, undercoated.. and the places I can't reach will be treated with a 3M body-cavity protectant (similar to wax + diesel fuel). It will be sprayed thought access holes where there is no access. I noticed that the frame head has some secret areas that are completely sealed.. But two well placed holes will allow me to 360' spray the oily wax solution. Preventing future rust.

I thought I was going to buzz right through this, but working with such thin gauge metal is challenging. I have two holes that I need to patch that are about 1sq inch. And also one of the front, main body pad plates needed to be cut out and replaced with ~1/8" plate (photo)

I picked up some Milwaukee (sheet metal) shears that rock! I haven't used metal shears in years. These things cut through the pan like it was.. yes, "butter". So I cut out patches and worked them until they were a press fit. Then I did a 1/2sec hot-mig tag in several places around the patch.

Hind sight being 20/20 I would have stopped there. As it was strong enough and with the addition of POR15 + undercoat would take care of any leftover seams or pin holes. Attempting to mig all around was just too risky, for me (due to blow through). Of course a TIG would be magical.. But sounds a bit overkill for such a mundane task, IMHO. Of course it's a easy to say when you DON'T HAVE ONE! :o]

So I thought I would try brazing the patches in places that were not mig'ed.. . Since it's only the pan, I thought it would be safe (and fun) to test how it would work. Well I did seal it all up. The brazing rod is a amazing material.. easy to fill gaps. However it does seem to get the metal nearly as hot as if I was going to gas weld it. However I may have been able to use a lower temperature.. The HEZ (heat effected zone) was minor. I don't know if I would want to use this method to fill in the body trim holes :oO But brass is like "leading" on steroids!

Even after the brazing, I still had tiny pin holes that eluded my best efforts. But I hadn't tried brazing in 20yrs.. that couldn't be it? :o} I'll let the sealers and coatings take care of them. As the areas are solid as a rock.

Next time..... I think I would just quick-mig the patches at various points around and call it a day. The POR would take care of the rest. It's not like it has to go down to the Marianas trench without imploding? It just needs to be solid enough to stop water from entering the car and my foot from leaving it.

I'm also making use of Metal Prep.. or as the POR-folk like to call it; "Metal Ready".. This is a great spray. It can keep the rust away from bare metal for many weeks.. months? I also tried "Weld Trough" pre-weld paint. It's loaded with zinc and is electrically conductible (for welding). The idea is to spray two panels that will be sandwiched and welded together, so that the un-seen metal will be protected. My first impressing? I HATED IT... I'll have to test it again.. but it felt like the weld area was contaminated (duh). And yet you are supposed to spay, and "weld through", hence the name.. I better read the instructions this time!

So, I'm working at a snail's pace. But once I started knocking these little things out of the way it was inspiring. Now I'm getting the trans in place (btw, the mounts are temporary.. just to hold the trans in the right position. Then I can see where I still have interference and where I have room to beef it up.

After that I can splice the pan half's back together (temporary) and put it all back in the car for one last trial fit. Then square up the pan to within 1/8" (max), and get those two half's back together for the last time. But hold off on the final welding until I get the cage built and in. Much easier to break a tack than a bead!



Cheers
Randy USA!
[1 edits; Last edit by EG33 at 00:58:33 Mon Jun 18 2012]

  

Pages: [ 1 2 ]

[ Notify ][ Print ][ Send To Friend ] [ Watch ] [ < ]

9 people online in the last 30 minutes - 0 members, 0 anon and 9 guests. (Most ever was 224 at 00:28:22 Thu Jan 19 2012)

 Total Members: 21647, Newest Member: 1Kawboy.

Register :: Log In

The time is now 00:54:30 Sat Nov 1 2014

Powered By BbBoard V1.4.2
© 2001-2007 BbBoy.net