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Heal NPD :: Open Topic :: Don't know how to proceed...
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melaniemac
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Don't know how to proceed... ( 19:40:23 WedApr 20 2005 )

My divorce has gotten very ugly. My ex has declared bankruptcy and left me on the hook for $26k. Then yesterday I receive this email:

Please arrange to have my grandfathers radio and accordion left outside your residence at 9:00 p.m. tomorrow Wed April 20,2005 for pick-up.

Now, the good thing is that he said please. That's a step up for him. Everybody wants me to deny this request as there is so much to work out in the way of property and his declaring bankruptcy less than three weeks after we just got out of court changes everything. He has many other things still in the house but I suspect he wants these two items to sell them. They are antiques.

If I deny him Lord only knows where that could lead and I'm tired of fighting. If I say yes, I'm just giving in to him yet again. These are family treasures and I'd really like for my boys to have them someday.

I have no idea what to do. any advice would be more than welcome.

Thanks for listening.

Mel

  
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TcBrown
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Re: Don't know how to proceed... ( 19:52:48 WedApr 20 2005 )

If these items belonged to his grandfather and have been left to him I think they are his property. I appreciate your desire for your boys to one day have them, and if they had belonged to your grandfather you'd be in a place to say what happens in this regard. However, I believe he has a right to his property unless it was clearly for the family or for the boys to one day have. If that is the case than its a whole other question and one the courts may be forced to wade through at some point.

I appreciate your frustration and feelings about the debt but the divorce could get even uglier if you battle over something he believes he has legitimate access to. His style of asking leaves a lot to be desired, but I suppose it is a step in the right direction he said please. :bigtimetrouble:



---
Instead of quoting the Budda, be the Budda, be "the awakened one," which is what the word budda means.

Eckhart Tolle, "The Power of Now"

 
 
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speerflaura
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Re: Don't know how to proceed... ( 20:12:00 WedApr 20 2005 )

Depends. Ask your lawyer if you have to give them to him. Tc is right, in my jurisdiction, that if it was left to him by inheritance, it's his. But if they came more or less casually, "here, take this old radio" and they're part of the household - the kids use the radio, say, or one of them takes accordion lessons - such items are usually sequestered for the wife and children (assuming she has the children). In that case, he could theoretically have them , or what's left of them, when the kids are of age.

I can hear you wondering, though, what is the best thing to do in any event. I'm sure part of you wants to fling them out the door after him, but if you do there's the danger that he will enjoy it so much that he'll start thinking of other things he wants. Or needs to do. Or has to have you do. My advice would be to draw a firm, hard line right here and now. Tell him you cannot possibly part with the smallest sDoo doo of anything at all in your house. Be sure he can't break in. And if he can (it's amazing how resourceful the former householder can be), take everything valuable/breakable out of the house and store it somewhere. At your parents' house is good.

This probably sounds belligerent, but it is not intended to be. The fact is that a few years down the road, you will be on half-way decent terms with this pernicious pest. That is, if he remains in the children's lives. If he takes off into the wild, you won't be. Either way though, you will have the boys' great-grandfather's accordion and radio for them. Their father may or may not have given them anything else. They should have this.

That's my opinion.

  
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melaniemac
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Re: Don't know how to proceed... ( 20:13:12 WedApr 20 2005 )

That's sort of my point to my family. It's one of those "pick your battles" type situations. He has also sent a snarky email informing when he will see the children. He's apparently pulling my oldest out of school for three days but has not offered any information as to where they might be going or why he needs to miss three days of school. I figure if I fight him on this one, he'll push even harder on that one.

But I am tired of the condescending attitude, but I really don't think it matters how I respond, that isn't going to change.

Thanks Tony!!

Mel

  
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Re: Don't know how to proceed... ( 11:05:24 ThuApr 21 2005 )

I hope whatever you decided to do it was done without referring to him in names such as what others call him here because I don't believe that will help your own peace of mind in the long run. One of the things I have learned about my own parents is they are in your life forever regardless of whether or not they are physically present. I tried denying that for a long time and believe me it was an ugly place to be. In other words even the smallest things stay with us, and the sh-t from a divorce tends never to be small. I have no clue how valid his claim to these items might be but it seems there must be a fair way to work this out.

Picking battles is probably a good thing and I think it would be a better fight to have over why he is pulling your son out of school and where he is taking him.,

  
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TcBrown
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Re: Don't know how to proceed... ( 15:19:56 ThuApr 21 2005 )

Good point about their father also being a part of the kids lives, zachery. I vividly recall sitting in therapy telling my psychologist that my father had been out of my life for years and had no influence on me whatsoever. Yeah, right. :onfire: Anything that can be done without flaming an already very difficult situation should be pursued. I can appreciate Mel's feelings about the debt, but these two antiques are not going to make up for what has already been done.

Mel, how might your reaction to all of this change if you try and see his behavior as fearful rather than attacking, with peace of mind as your only goal?



---
Instead of quoting the Budda, be the Budda, be "the awakened one," which is what the word budda means.

Eckhart Tolle, "The Power of Now"

 
 
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melaniemac
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Re: Don't know how to proceed... ( 16:05:31 ThuApr 21 2005 )

Tony, I am fully aware that he is reacting out of fear and confusion. It's just really, really hard to deal with a person like that. You can try as hard as you want to be rational but it just doesn't seem to make a difference.

I did give him the items by the way. I just couldn't see how withholding them would do either of us any good. My family isn't happy about it, but they are not the ones that have to deal with him. I just wish all this child support/bankruptcy stuff was over so that we could move forward. Until all this is settled he is going to be highly aggitated and difficult to deal with. And he does tend to say things to the children so I have to be careful. I don't want them in the middle and whenever he is upset with me, he makes comments to them. I'm glad I have them seeing a counsellor. It tends to be very emotional for them, but I think they need to talk about what is going on. The boys often say things to her that they are afraid to talk to me about.

I'm still trying to figure out how to respond to his other email about the children. The part I find so frustruating is that no matter what I say, if it is no, he gets irrate. It doesn't matter how I explain it. And my concern is always the children, and how what I do affects them, not only when they are with me, but how he treats them when with him.... It's tough being the grown-up (LOL!! - yeah, right!)

Anyway, thanks again for your imput. Sometimes a person just needs to talk things through!!

Mel

  
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TcBrown
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Re: Don't know how to proceed... ( 16:50:53 ThuApr 21 2005 )

Mel, I would suggest to you that using the lessons of AH in responding with your husband not only is the best way to avoid adding to the conflict, so far these lessons are the only way I have found of reaching people in such emotional turmoil. I have seen how they changed my life and I have seen repeatedly how they reach others who often appear unreachable. However, the hard part for you is to not practice them with your head (ego), but from your heart. I hear you saying you want peace, but I also hear your ego feeling resentful that you have to do all the hard work. I actually believe its harder to respond in fear than is with love because if our fear is there we have to maintain all the ego defences giving life to this fear.

I can relate to the difficulty accepting no for an answer because it was, and I suppose to a degree still is, something that I have to work on. I've come to a place where its usually fairly easy for me to accept no if I think there is a good reason. Sometimes I am still very disappointed with the answer, but at least I don't feel a need to be irate or act out.

I recall once going through a silent treatment period with my therapist for several sessions because he said no to something I wanted him to do. We literally sat there with silence between us for 3 or 4 sessions. It was I suppose a learning opportunity, but it got kind of expensive to be silent at $70 a session. :crazy: Maybe working through that has helped me learn to accept no, clearly it has, but I needed a teacher who was willing to maintain his boundries and be very supportive at the same time. Chances are you are not the best person to be that teacher for him, at least not yet, but maybe one day soon he will make contact with such a teacher. In the meantime just be sure your answers are not fear based and you should be able to be peaceful that you are doing your best in the relationship.

Tony




---
Instead of quoting the Budda, be the Budda, be "the awakened one," which is what the word budda means.

Eckhart Tolle, "The Power of Now"

 
 
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melaniemac
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Re: Don't know how to proceed... ( 17:18:41 ThuApr 21 2005 )

I don't know so much that I'm resentful (although you are right, there is definately that part of it), it's just that I am exhausted. Physically and emotionally. I'm not sleeping. I have a lot of stress at work on top of what is going on in my personal life. I just need a break I think, but don't foresee one coming any time soon. Every vacation day I have used this year (and I've used over half of my days already) has been to go to court, see my lawyer or because myself or my children have been sick.

I am meditating (well, as close to meditation as I seem able to get) and praying every day. It helps, but I'm just tired, tired, tired.... The fact that the weather has warmed up has helped greatly!!

That is why I am so slow to respond to him. I want to make sure that what I am saying comes across clearly yet doesn't come off sounding bitter, angry or controlling.

Thanks,

Mel

  
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Re: Don't know how to proceed... ( 18:59:48 ThuApr 21 2005 )

Mel, do you have legal custody of the children? If you do, you have the right and the duty to know where they are at all times - who they're with and what they're doing and why. If you have custody, it is your job to make decisions about school. Their dad is all antsy and upset right now, and is not in a fit condition to handle the responsibility he's assuming, and if you have legal custody, he DOES NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO DO IT. I don't mean you should yell at him - I'm trying to make the point that it's important that you protect these children, and if you can't do it without making him angrier than he already is, you have to do it anyway, and just accept the anger.

  
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